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Hello, welcome to the Frankly Speaking podcast. Today I am joined by Hot High Priestess, also known as Sarah. She is a very popular content creator, does a lot of stuff with astrology and other mythical type stuff. Is that correct?

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I would say tarot and manifestation, mindset, things like that, but the spiritual realm is really what I post about.

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Very cool. So tarot. Could you repeat that for me? Is like tarot something mindset?

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Yeah, tarot manifestation and just like general mindset coaching.

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Very cool. So I guess kind of to start off, like what got you? Well, first, what got you into content creation? And then I guess we'll kind of go from there.

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Yeah, I mean, so what got me into content creation was really like the start of TikTok,

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right? Because, um, at the time, this was actually about two years ago, almost exactly. I posted my first

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video on TikTok. Um, I was really into tarot at the time. So, um, it was very popular on YouTube. There

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were like pick a card readings trending. And I was like very obsessed with it. So I learned how to read tarot

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around that time. And I saw that it was like popping up on my for you page. It was like really, really

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popular at the time, um, two years ago, like right before the pandemic. Um, and so I don't know, I just

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felt this like calling almost to post tarot videos. Um, and so I did had no idea it would like blow up on

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the first try. Um, so yeah, I posted a video about two years ago. Um, it was actually a series of three

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videos. It was like the one you see is the one you're meant to hear type of thing. And one of

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the videos got like a million views. And I was like, this is absolutely insane. And I'm sure you've felt

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the feeling where it's like the dopamine rush of like having your viral video. There's no drugs could

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ever compare, I feel, but yeah. So that's kind of how I got into it. Nice. That seems like a pretty, uh,

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common story for a lot of the creators. It's like almost started the pandemic. And then, um, as far

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as like that dopamine rush, I think it's artificial. So like I've heard even really big creators talk

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about it, like MKBHD. He's like this tech YouTuber. Um, yeah. So he had a video that hit like 150 million

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views and that's like more than any of his previous content ever. And he's like, yeah, there's like

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nothing saying that this is better than anything else. Um, and I think one of my first videos also

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hit like several million, but like, I think it's because it artificially pushes it out because it's

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trying to get content creators addicted to making content. It's like chasing the dragon. And like,

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I have a feeling that it's not just for that first video, but like every X number of videos.

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So like, sometimes I'll have a video that has like really poor stats. So like, I guess like, you know,

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you probably also have found out that like, generally if something has like above a 10% like ratio and

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then like, I don't know, X percent comment ratio and shares and stuff, like you can kind of tell

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what's going to do well, even within like the first hour or first day, it's like you can guesstimate

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where it's going to go. Um, and I, you, I've started to notice that like, sometimes the ratios are

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really terrible, but it'll still be pumped out more. Um, because I think that it's like the system

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doesn't make a whole lot of sense. If you think about like the promotion scheme, because when you

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promote a video, why wouldn't it always use the best algorithm to get your video to the most amount of

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people possible? So I feel like there's like different algorithms and they like rotate them

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in and out.

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Yeah. I always wondered what, like, if there's like an actual set algorithm or if it's just like,

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if it's constantly changing, like, I feel like, do people actually know what the algorithm is or is

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everyone just speculating?

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I think it's a lot of speculation, but just based on like what I know about tech, um, I think it also

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changes on a sense of like people are making code changes. Um, and like how AI works. I don't want

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to hijack too much of this podcast. So I'll just briefly go over it, but it's basically like machines,

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teaching machines and testing other machines. And so like, as an engineer, you can tweak a bunch of

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like variables to get the outcome you want, which is to have viewers stay on TikTok for as long as

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possible. Um, but at a certain point, like humans have no idea what's going on. It's just like

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a bunch of AI magic, uh, behind the scenes that you can kind of have a bunch of levers that you can

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pull. Uh, and then you can kind of view like, okay, this makes the view metric go up or down or

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whatever. Um, but yeah, it's like there's, I doubt there's a single like person or engineer that could

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explain it at this point. Yeah. We're all figuring it out. Never know. Um, but yeah, so go back,

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back to the tarot cards. I always thought it was tarot. It's tarot. A lot of people mispronounce

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it. I actually don't know why there's a T at the end. Who knows? What's the, um, the language of origin

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there? Um, I believe Italian. I believe like the origins of it are from Italy. Um, Rome or no, Milan

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or Rome. I'm not sure. But yeah, Italy, I'm pretty sure. So some sort of European. I was kind of,

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for some reason in my mind, I associated more with like Eastern mystical stuff, but I guess that's,

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I don't know if they're related at all. Yeah. Um, I mean, tarot has been used worldwide. I believe

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the origins of tarot was that it was actually, um, the, the deck itself was, um, a Italian card game

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called Tarot Cheney or something like that. And it then was used for divination practices

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by like women. So, um, it was a card game. Some people still play it to this day. I don't know how

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you play it, but because honestly, a tarot deck is quite similar to like a standard deck of cards,

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just has like, it has like suits, things like that. So there's a lot of similarity there.

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Yeah. I'm only vaguely familiar because a video game I played, they like dealt you this deck and

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then like, depending on what you get, it would affect your like units and stats. Um, but as far

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as like the divination aspect, like, is it also kind of in the same realm as like, uh, palm reading?

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Like, I know that's like a pseudo popular thing as well. Um, and then as far as like the cards

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yourself, like, do you have a deck of cards? Have you done any readings for like yourself or other people

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or? Yeah. So, um, I would say tarot is unique in that statistically speaking, right? The odds of like,

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in a deck of 78 cards with you, um, like each card has its own meaning, but it also has a different

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meaning upright versus reversed. Um, so statistically speaking, the odds of you having like, let's say

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seven cards, 10 cards laid out and those cards being the exact same as someone else are very,

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very low. So I feel like it's very unique in that sense that it's just very, it can be very specific.

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I feel like a lot of tarot readers like to keep it more general, obviously, especially on

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TikTok, you're going to make it more general because it's like for a collective, but it can

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be very specific. And I think that's like the beauty of tarot is it, it just, it feels very personalized.

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Um, and a good tarot reader will get personal and you'll feel like it was really meant for you.

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Um, which is why I think it was really taking off on TikTok, but I would say palm reading is more

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so like astrology where it's like, it's your birth, like, um, like you're kind of just born with it,

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right? Like same with astrology, you have your own like birth chart. Um, so same thing with palm

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reading. I'm not a palm reader though, but, um, but yeah, tarot is unique because it's constantly

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changing. So the way we view it is like, as your current energy is changing, um, the cards that you're

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going to get are going to change. I see. So I, like you said at the beginning, it's more like

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divination, future telling rather than like a predetermined here's your base nature or whatever.

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Yeah, exactly. So, um, the way I kind of explained tarot is it's like, it's tapping into your current

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energy to predict what, where your current energy is leading you. So it's not like this is your

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determined fate, but it's more like this is where you're heading. If you continue maintaining the

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same energy, if that makes sense. Yeah, I could see that. And I feel like that's also

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like, so I'm obviously like, I'm like very logically minded as this isn't like an area

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I've explored at all before, but just like kind of looking at it from the outside, it's like,

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this would actually be a lot harder to disprove as well. Cause like a lot of people will just give

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a ton of grief to astrology. Cause they're like, Hey, look at X, Y, Z. Like, you know,

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you can concretely disprove this. Like it logically doesn't make sense for, you know,

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this birth thing or like this predetermined outcome. But then with tarot, cause it's constantly

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changing. There's also the aspect of like, you can't like disprove it because the future is always

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changing anyway. So it's like, even if you, right. Like butterfly effect type of thing.

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So I think that aspect is also kind of interesting.

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Yeah, absolutely. It's very, and I have to say, like, I was very logically minded. I mean,

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I still would say I am, um, but I was very like atheist, very like anti spirituality, um,

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before I got into all of this stuff. And I think at some point there were just so many coincidences

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where I was like, even if this is complete bullshit, like it's helping my life so much.

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It's making me have so much hope. Um, and it's just so oddly specific that like,

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I can't ignore the reality of the situation here. You know what I mean? Like it doesn't make sense,

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but it, it, it just is what it is, you know?

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Yeah. I think that spirituality is pretty underrated. Like, so I still am an atheist,

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but like that aspect, um, I feel like it has, has been missing from my life. Like I'm pretty

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jealous of people who have either like a community or just like kind of belief in like more than just

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worldly things, right? Like more than just this. So some sort of like more, whether that's like

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religion or some other forms of spirituality, I think that like, it does bring a lot of benefit

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for a lot of people. Um, and like you said, it's, it's hard to say like whether it's true or not.

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And there's like the, I forget, it might be called Pascal's Wager, where it's like,

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you should might as well try to pick a religion and believe in it because off chance that it's

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real, it's like, Hey, at least you picked one. Exactly. Exactly. Although like Pascal's Wager,

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but I took a theology class in college and I hated him, but yeah, no, it's true. I mean,

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I think at the end of the day, if it's benefiting you and it's not hurting someone else, like,

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what do you have to lose? And I also think the thing about tarot is it's such a,

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like, there are going to be readers who are just like, this is your future do with that as you will.

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And there's going to be readers that are like, okay, like, what's the situation you're going

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through? Let me guide you through that spiritually. I find that a lot of the people that I work with,

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because I used to do like one-on-one readings, um, you know, obviously I read for myself and things

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like that. I feel like it just provides you with guidance because the, the tarot deck essentially like

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follows the themes of life. And so it's really like, it's just a bunch of like lessons in cards.

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So when you pull certain cards, it's like teaching you a certain lesson about the experience you're

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going through. It offers a different way or a different perspective to look at the situation.

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So I really feel like if anything, it's just like a way of life more so than like anything religious or

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anything of that nature. And then you kind of mentioned that you already had previous clients.

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Like, have you thought about kind of continuing to pursue this avenue, whether that's like content

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creation and the tarot and the spirituality and the manifestation, which I kind of want to get into

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a bit later as well. But have you thought about continuing to pursue this path? And I don't know how

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much of your like current situation you wanted to be public, like, um, your like age and college status

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and stuff. But, uh, yeah, I guess like, what are your plans, uh, in terms of like future career

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and is it going to be involved with what you're currently doing?

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Yeah. Oh my God. I'm so excited about this. Cause I was just telling Frank that I just finished

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college, which is really exciting. Um, and what's so interesting is like, I went into college,

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um, studying double majoring in education and history, like hoping to go be a teacher and go

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into education policy. Um, and then when things blew up, I realized very quickly that this

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could very well be a full-time opportunity for me. Um, so that was two years ago. And I'm

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very grateful that since then, like I've turned it into my full-time job and my business. Um, and it's

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been luckily very successful for me. So that's, I'm planning on continuing to pursue that. Um,

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um, especially the manifestation side of it. Um, because currently I have like a manifesting workshop,

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um, and yeah, I just want to continue with like the coaching aspect of manifestation. So that's what

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I'm doing right now. Those are my current plans, but I love education. Um, that was like my biggest

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passion. And for me, I think the reason I was really drawn to manifestation was because of

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the parallels between what I was learning as an education and psych student, um, and manifestation.

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That's awesome. So it sounds like, I guess, well, one, you found both like monetary success,

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but also like potentially the larger reach of the platform. So I think that like

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a lot of people realize that on online platforms, like you make a random 30 second video could reach

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like a million plus people compared to like doing one local job as a teacher while you're still making

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a really big difference. You'll still only be able to influence like 30, 60 kids or so per year, every

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year. Yeah, exactly. And I mean, that's something I, you know, obviously had to debate because,

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you know, I was really passionate about teaching and education. Um, but I realized

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very quickly that my reach was a lot broader, um, on social media, obviously. And I was changing,

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you know, instead of like you said, like 60 kids lives a day, like thousands and thousands of people's

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lives a day. Um, and so, you know, ultimately to, for me, like what I teach and what I coach people on

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is how to change your mindset so that you believe in yourself and the ability that you have to

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accomplish something, which I feel like is something so many students in the education system,

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you know, don't, aren't taught. Um, so in a way I feel like I'm kind of doing what I always wanted

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to do for my students, but for a larger audience. Yeah. Now that you've talked about it, I kind of came

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into this, like not sure what to expect, but for what it sounds like, it sounds like a lot of it more

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is just motivational. So it's, it's not really about like the mystical per se, like that's a way to wrap

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it and present it and share it and have people like buy into this methodology. Um, but that's

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like similar to any other self-improvement type methodology. Like if it works and it sounds like

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it does, um, it could just be, it's more really about, like you said, self-improvement and having

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people just like believe in themselves rather than like, oh, what's your daily horoscope type of thing.

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Exactly. Exactly. And I think specifically for manifestation, which is like the art of like

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changing your thoughts to therefore change your reality. So much of that is psychology in spiritual

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terms, you know? Um, and I like, I think what's so interesting as people, I think, especially right

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now, like it's very trendy, obviously. I think a lot of people are very drawn to spirituality, but

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it's like the same thing that everyone's been saying, just wrapped in a different label, you know what

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I mean? Um, but I will say there are spiritual aspects to it as well. Um, and I think you can pick

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and choose like how much of spirituality you want in manifestation. Um, but at the end of the day,

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when you break it down to the, the, the things that manifestation coaches teach, like that stuff

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therapists are teaching that stuff that self-help people and motivational speakers are talking about.

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So it's really all in the same. Um, but I do think there's an element of magic to it, you know? Um,

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so yeah, I think a lot of things like people can't explicitly explain the science. Like they do a

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bunch of studies with like placebos and find out like, Oh, you know, the people believing that they got

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a drug actually makes them healthier. Uh, maybe because it reduces stress, like maybe these like

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logical reasons, but in essence, it is somewhat like magic. It's like the power of belief or like

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the power of laughter or friendship and all these things that are like somewhat children's tales or

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like things that we tell little kids, make-believe stories. A lot of it is kind of real in a sense,

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um, which is really kind of interesting. Exactly. And I will. Um, so like one of the reasons I got into

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manifestation specifically was, um, because at the time when I like discovered manifestation,

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I was learning about growth mindset, which is like, um, something studied by Carol Dweck in psychology.

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And it's this idea that if you tell students, for example, that they are capable of achieving,

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let's say an A, even though right now they might be at a C instead of telling them like,

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you have like having the fixed mindset of like, you have a C, sorry, like you're just not meant to

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succeed. If you, as a teacher tell them like, you're going to achieve an A, you have the ability to grow

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here. Um, studies have found that students become much more capable and likely to achieve an A,

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um, and I feel like, you know, in a way manifestation is pretty much that because if you continuously

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repeat to yourself, I am successful, I'm destined for success, you know, I'm destined to find love.

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Just having the belief is going to make you more likely to achieve it. And again, like, I think

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a lot of people, you know, will look at spirituality and be like, it's a pseudoscience. And I'm like,

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well, make the connections here, you know? Um, and another thing is the reticular activating system,

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which is, um, our brains function to focus in on a particular thing. So for example,

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if you, if I'd asked you today, like how many red cars did you see when you walked around in your

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neighborhood, you probably wouldn't be able to tell me, but now that we've talked about red cars,

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now that it's in your head, you know, you're going to start noticing, oh my God, there's like a lot

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of red cars in my neighborhood. And that's how manifestation works. That's how the brain works,

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but it's also how manifestation works. Because when you're telling yourself I'm abundant,

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you're going to start to see abundance all around you. And reality is not like one of my favorite

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quotes is there is no reality there, or there is no truth. There are only points of view.

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And like everything in life, our reality is the way that we choose things, the way that we,

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our brain neurologically perceives things, consciously perceives things. So if you can

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change your consciousness and the way you choose to perceive things, then your reality changes. That's

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just like, that's just psychology 101, you know?

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Yeah. And it's funny that you kind of mentioned all these things, because when I was younger,

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I actually also wanted to be a history major. I didn't want to be a teacher, though. And I was

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also really interested in psychology. And a lot of the things that you talked about, like the growth

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mindset, it even goes beyond that. It's like when people don't realize what they can achieve,

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they don't. And the whole manifestation thing, there's really famous examples of it too.

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Like Logan Paul going to the mirror, being like, "Hey, I'm going to be the biggest social media

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influencer." Literally told himself every day in the mirror in the morning. And then I guess kind of

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wrapping it, looping it back around. As far as the growth mindset thing, it's like, as you mentioned,

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there were a bunch of studies and they all show that it is the correct way to kind of bring up your

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kids these days. Like telling them that over these very long decade years of studies, they find that

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people who have that mindset just achieve more, like they're more successful, make more money,

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happier, et cetera, et cetera. Exactly, exactly. And that's just like one example.

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Then you also have all of the examples of like how things like meditation, for example,

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can literally like better your immune system, you know, reduce. There have been multiples,

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like one of my psych one-on-one classes, brain, mind and behavior or something like that was,

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we talked about how literally by meditating every day, like in a study, people who meditated every

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day were less susceptible to like being sick than the other people. You know what I mean? It's like

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your mind literally controls your body, the way that you act on a day-to-day basis. And those small,

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small actions eventually lead up to your ultimate destiny or reality or whatever it is. So mindset

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really is everything in my opinion, I think, especially when you come from a situation where

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you weren't raised with the best environment and maybe you weren't encouraged at all growing up. So I think

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a lot of people find manifestation and they're like, this is like the first time I've heard this,

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this is the first time I've been encouraged and I have faith in myself. So yeah.

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Like kind of talking through this, it just seems like a much more positive spin

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on the way that maybe the genders are encouraged. Because I've noticed that like a lot of male

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encouragement is more about bringing you down, like tearing you down and then saying like, hey,

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like you suck, like you're fat, you're weak, you're poor. And now you need to buy my course to like

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fix that, right? Like I'm rich, I'm successful, let me teach you my secrets. So clearly you can't do it on

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your own. Whereas like this seems just like a much more healthy version of like,

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hey, you can do it. Like you should believe in yourself. Like you have all these things and you

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just have to like kind of, you know, will it into existence in a way. I was kind of thinking on this

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the other day where it's like, I think the reason that people do it the other way is that like

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it might make more money. Like that pipeline is a bit more profitable because

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I read about like the X steps to like grow essentially a cult following or like the X steps

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to like convince people, like first you convince people that they have a problem and then you have

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a way to like fix their problem. But like a lot of people, if they're not convinced that they have

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that problem, then they might not necessarily like reach for a solution. Does that make sense?

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Marketing 101, yeah. No, that's so interesting. I never even thought about that because my demographic is

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like 90% women. So I think I would say it is definitely a much more like supportive and

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positive community. But you're right, like you have to, in order to sell something, you have to

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make people believe there is a problem. But I would argue like telling guys like you're broke and

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whatever it is, like eventually like if you keep, if you make it seem like so much of a problem,

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you also have to convince them that they're, that you'd be able to have a solution for them. You know

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what I mean? But yeah, I think encouragement is definitely more seen around the female demographic.

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Yeah, I've also seen where it kind of shows that like females just in general seem to have more

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positivity in the self-improvement space where like in the male space, it seems a lot of it,

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even though people are tearing each other down, males are like accepting of that. It's like we're used to

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getting kind of bombarded by negativity, just like even in casual day-to-day life, like we're roasting

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each other all the time. But then a lot of people take it still decently well. Like if someone calls

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you fat, you're like, yeah, you're right. I should go work out. Whereas like, I think

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it's not really acceptable to say that to a woman these days. Like it's, it's like you don't see,

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at least I don't see anyway. I see like plus size models, which is like super common nowadays,

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but I have yet to see a plus size male model like featured prominently everywhere. And I think

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that's like both genders kind of shit on them. Right. Cause like, if you see like a fat dude,

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he's not getting compliments from anyone. Right. Like if you see a fat woman, like she's going to get

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compliments from women at least, like guys are probably not going to compliment her, but it's

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kind of like this double standard. Um, but it's, I think it's a bit more complex than the double

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standard. Cause like, I think women are more prized for their beauty and then guys are more prized for

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like their money or career or whatever. Um, so it's a bit more nuanced, but I still think that like

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dichotomy is, is kind of interesting. Why do you think that exists? I'm curious amongst men,

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amongst men. I think a lot of it has to do with competition. Cause it's kind of like,

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I guess the theory is that like you, I think that men are maybe because of like testosterone,

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just a lot more like they go, they reach for the tops. Like they go more extreme. And like,

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I guess the kind of famous, not famous, but a relevant point where like, um, misogynists always

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say like, Oh, women are really bad at driving. And then the counter to that is like, Oh, well,

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why do men, um, get charged more for insurance because they are in more accidents. And then,

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but then when you look into the data on like what is actually going on, uh, men are in much more

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high speed accidents. So like the majority of like low speed accidents are from women.

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And that's, and it actually has to do with like our biology. So like men have like this way to

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perceive objects in 3d space more accurately than women. And so that would explain the like

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discrepancy there. But then as far as like the risk taking ability, I think a lot of it has to do

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with testosterone and just natural biology. Um, and then obviously. Sorry, the hunter mentality.

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Maybe. I don't know. I've read different things on the hunter theory because before it was assumed

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that like all women stayed home and did like child rearing. But then there are other anthropologists

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who are like, well, no, like someone, women also helped with the hunt. Because if you think about it,

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it's like both genders can throw a spear. Um, and a lot of it is more like teamwork rather than like

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an individual hunter taking down a woolly man. Uh, so yeah, it's really hard to say, but like

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as far as like why I think that is, I think a lot of it comes down to biology and then obviously cultural.

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Um, I think there are like inherent differences. So like, I think a lot of it has to do with like

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the hormones that our bodies produce. And like you mentioned earlier before, like a lot of it is mind.

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Um, yeah. And this is only semi-related to our point that we're talking about, but also

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more research has come in and saying like a lot of it has to do with our gut biomes and like

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what we eat and how, even though we're so smart, a lot of what we do is actually influenced by

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just really basic bodily urges. Like if you're hungry, so there is like a study done on

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judges. And if they gave out harsher sentences, so like basically before lunchtime, judges would

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consistently give out harsher sentences and they can justify it however they want. Cause these are

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smart dudes, right? Uh, smart people. So they can have whatever nuance and logic and reasoning,

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but it turns out it's like, no, they're just in a bad mood because they're hungry. So stuff like that.

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Um, let's hope I don't get sued and have a judge before lunch. Like that's crazy. I mean, yeah,

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I think it all comes down to like biology instinct with men though, especially I feel,

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you know, I feel like men are more instinctually inclined to do things. Um, and I feel like society

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almost nourishes or encourages the instance of men. Um, yeah.

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Yeah. It's kind of weird in a corporate setting though, because like the same thing that a man can

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be praised for, a woman will get shit on. So like being assertive is always typically seen as a

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positive if you're a guy, but as a woman, you have to balance it. You can't be too assertive,

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but you also can't be like a pushover. And it's like a, you know, you're walking this

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tight rope of trying to navigate corporate politics. Um, and then like another layer on

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that, like the ethnicity that you are also makes a huge difference. So like, uh, if you're black and

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you're really aggressive, people are like, Oh, that's a thug. Right. And that's, that's kind of

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messed up, but that's kind of what I've seen even at Netflix, right? People, uh, it's, it's really

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weird. Like racism is totally a thing in the tech industry. I mean, pretty much everywhere, but it's

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really noticeable in tech as well. Um, but if you're white and you do the exact same thing, like

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no one will blink an eye. Um, and then for me, like I'm Asian, well, I look Asian, right? But

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I'm very Westernized. Like I grew up in the West, but if I'm overly aggressive, people are like, Hey,

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you're out of line. And I'm like, dude, what it's, and you know, you can't concretely say it was

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because of my race or whatever, but it's, I don't know. It's again, I guess kind of veered off topic,

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but, um, going back to relevant. Yeah. Going back to your audience, like, what do you think,

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or why do you think that manifestation appeals a lot more to women than to men? Because like,

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I have never really looked much into it, but like talking through it with you, like,

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it sounds very positive. Like, it sounds like a lot of men would kind of resonate with the message of,

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like, Hey, believe in yourself and like, you can do it if you think you can do it.

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Right. I mean, exactly. And I, I hope that in the future, more men are open to it, which is why I

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was like, so happy that you reached out. Cause I was like, wow, like that's awesome. You know? Um,

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but I think what it comes down to is spirituality. I mean, you know, there's like feminine energy and

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masculine energy and spirituality as a whole is a very feminine energy type thing. Um, so on a

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spiritual level, I think that's why women are more drawn to spirituality. Um, but just logically

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speaking, I think part of it is one society, like the fact that men are supposed to be tough and,

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you know, never be in pain and never mentally, you know, never be in a mental state of like distress

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or whatever. Um, and I think in general society encourages women to heal themselves. It's just

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like a society thing, but I also think it's the way social media frames like manifestation,

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spirituality and all of that. Um, it's, you know, we, we do like, um, you know, a manifestation journal,

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moon water, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And all these like girly type things that I think men,

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you know, would be judged for, for doing. Um, so I think part of it is that, and also representation,

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I think the spiritual community is primarily comprised of women and LGBTQ people. So

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I think it comes down to that. Um, but I really hope moving forward that more men are a part of

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the spiritual community because it's, it really is an amazing place and has changed the lives of so

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many. And I will say, I have a lot of clients who are men. Um, they're a lot more quiet than the women,

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but the changes I see in them is astonishing because I feel like they tap into a part of themselves that

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they literally never have, you know, and they're able to express themselves in a way they never have.

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And I think that's really important touching the feminine energy, that side of them. Um,

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it's very powerful, but yeah, I think it just comes down to like society. I mean, you shift society a

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little bit. It's really funny that you, you mentioned like feminine and masculine energy,

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because like in a sense, feminine energy is just being emotionally intelligent, like knowing how to

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be in touch with your feelings and knowing how to communicate with others. And like, men don't have

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that. Like guys are just, we're just stunted. We're like children. Um, yeah.

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Yeah. So I think that's, it's funny because like,

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I think that, so women already like mentally mature much more quickly, but then it's especially

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evident when you look at a playground. So like, there's like many Game of Thrones going on when

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girls are in middle school and guys are just like, you know, playing sports, fighting each other.

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And like you said, like we don't, I think guys, they bond by doing stuff. So like, we'll

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go ride our bikes or go play a game of basketball or like go camping or whatever. But then women

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bond by talking. Like my wife still talks to people all the time, like calls all her friends and family

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and stuff. Like I've done that less than a dozen times my entire life. Like, it's just not a thing that

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guys do. Um, I don't know why, but like, it's not a thing. Um, yeah. And I think that's really

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damages our society because like people being made fun of for doing feminine things. Like that's just,

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that's dumb. I think whenever people shame each other, and that's one part I really don't like

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about the self-improvement side of the, of males is like, it's so much based around like you are

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inadequate. And I think that's, you know, that's just not true in a sense because like people have

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so much potential to do whatever they want. And yeah, I don't know. It's, I don't know where I was

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going with this point, but, um, I think that guys, if they were truly like confident in themselves,

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like they wouldn't worry about others judging them for whatever, right? Like whether it's

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society or other people, if people are truly confident in themselves, they'll do whatever

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they want. Like whether that's a female or male, like you just kind of don't listen to other people's

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judgments and do whatever is right for you. And as you mentioned earlier, as long as you're not

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hurting anyone, like you're just doing it for yourself, like it, I think it's great. Cause like,

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like everyone's benefiting in a sense. I know. And going back to what you were saying about,

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like, first of all, I think that's really insightful for me because I've seen it for

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sure. Especially like, you know, when you're scrolling on your for you page and it's like

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12 p.m. And then you see like, or 12 a.m. And you see that one video of like a dude being like,

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get the fuck up. Like you're a piece of shit. You're so lazy. I'm like, dude, I'm trying to go to bed.

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Like this video and it's like me and I'm like, Oh my God, you're amazing. And blah, blah, blah, blah,

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blah. Um, so yeah, it's, it's definitely a contrast, but I don't think I ever like realized

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it because I don't think I necessarily attract that demographic at all. But yeah, I, and I think like,

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I would bet, um, on the fact that like manifestation coaches have way more successful clients than these

366
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:27,600
like male, you know, coaches who like, you know, try to make you feel like shit because I mean,

367
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:34,560
at least in my philosophy, it is like, you don't attract what it is that you want. You attract what

368
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:40,320
you believe that you are. You know what I mean? So if you're constantly being told you're fat,

369
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:45,840
you're broke, like, and that's your identity, that's who you identify as. That's exactly what you're going

370
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:51,280
to continue being and who you'll become. And the way that we kind of teach it is like,

371
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:58,560
you have to already think from the, the identity of who you want to be. You have to show up as that

372
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:03,120
person, as that person who's already skinny, that person who's already rich and successful, you know?

373
00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:11,040
So I feel like, and I don't know, maybe, well, I will say one thing. I think men instinctually are

374
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:16,560
really, um, driven by competent, like we were saying competition, but specifically by challenges.

375
00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:22,240
And you learn about this, like when you go into like the psychology of dating, because men love a

376
00:36:22,240 --> 00:36:27,760
challenge. Men love to chase after women, you know, like to, like, it feels so much more satisfying to,

377
00:36:28,640 --> 00:36:35,360
you know, pull a woman who is, you know, like hard to pull than someone who's openly available,

378
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:40,800
right? Because of that challenge. Whereas I feel like when like a man who's not, you don't like to

379
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:45,920
like chase, because again, it goes back to feminine and masculine energy. Feminine energy is receiving

380
00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:53,600
energy and masculine energy is pursuing energy. And so I think in a way, maybe it is more encouraging for

381
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:59,280
men specifically, um, to improve themselves when they feel like there is that challenge.

382
00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:04,800
Um, but I think for women, we have to, it also goes back to growth mindset. We have to believe that we

383
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:12,080
can become that person. Um, so yeah, I don't know, but it's interesting seeing the, the contrast there.

384
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:18,080
Yeah. I mean, I would guess that you're completely right. And that the growth mindset,

385
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:22,160
like positivity is going to work better. Like even going back to psychology one-on-one,

386
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:26,960
one of the first things you learn is that, uh, essentially punishments don't work. And like,

387
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:31,600
the only thing that changes behavior is positive reinforcement, uh, or negative reinforcement,

388
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:35,600
which is for people who don't know the taking away of something painful. So like,

389
00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:40,960
if you have a pin in your shoe, removing that, um, is also effective, but not punishing someone,

390
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:47,440
right? Like not shitting on them. And like, I'm, I bet they've probably done a study on this.

391
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:52,320
Maybe I feel like a lot of studies that they do is essentially just taking common sense

392
00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:55,920
and then quantifying it. And then being like, here's a hypothesis. Let's actually measure it.

393
00:37:55,920 --> 00:38:02,000
It's like, Oh yeah. What do you know? We found out this is actually the case. Um, but I'd be surprised

394
00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:08,240
if that just because it's popular right now, and because it kind of goes in line with our societal

395
00:38:08,240 --> 00:38:16,320
standards that tearing people down builds them up. Cause like you said, if you're have,

396
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:21,440
if you have a low self-esteem and people are keeping it where it's at, like, how do you get,

397
00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:25,040
how do you, how does that change to becoming high self-esteem? It's like,

398
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:28,960
this course is not going to change it, right? You learn some techniques, but it's like your sense of

399
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:34,880
self doesn't really change. Um, and then even looking at popular examples or these studies,

400
00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:38,560
like all the people who achieve, like they have that growth mindset. They have, they believe in

401
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:46,240
themselves. It's not like they got the secrets from some guru who sold them a $25 monthly course.

402
00:38:46,240 --> 00:38:49,040
Um, it's, this is the people who like believed in themselves.

403
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:54,560
Exactly. Exactly. And I don't think that people who are successful are going in the mirror and saying,

404
00:38:54,560 --> 00:39:01,360
I'm a fat piece of shit. No, they did that. I'm going to be exactly who I want to be. And so,

405
00:39:01,360 --> 00:39:07,680
yeah, I think it always goes back to like growth mindset and like the shit that I teach, you know?

406
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:11,760
So a hundred percent. Yeah. I think that it's like,

407
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:17,200
it's also challenging in a sense to get that message to males. Cause I bet people are making

408
00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:21,920
this type of content, but it does, it's not popular because like, it doesn't resonate for some reason.

409
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:30,000
Um, and it's hard to say why. Yeah. I wonder, like, I feel, I don't know. It's hard to reach

410
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:36,160
the male audience, especially with the way that I present my information. Um, and I mean, also I can

411
00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:42,240
only speak for myself and my experiences. And a lot of what I do is like love manifestations. So,

412
00:39:42,240 --> 00:39:50,240
you know, it gets difficult there, but I wonder how, you know, as self-help manifestation coaches,

413
00:39:50,240 --> 00:40:00,960
how we can reach those people, you know, I don't know. Um, but I found that comedy resonates really

414
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:07,120
well. Like low brass, crude humor resonates well with the male population, regardless of the age. Like,

415
00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:14,640
if someone tells me a really good, just kind of like low crass joke, I'll still probably laugh,

416
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:18,960
even though I know it's like completely immature and it's not funny in like the,

417
00:40:21,040 --> 00:40:26,000
I guess, intelligent sense or like comedic sense, but it'll just be like low brass humor.

418
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:32,640
Um, that does pretty well, but then it's hard to like have an informational message in a joke. So I

419
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:39,280
think that comedians do this extremely well. Um, a lot of male comedians, um, that are able to weave

420
00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:45,520
an actually insightful message, but within the context of like a larger comedy sketch where you

421
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:51,840
intercede it with points that are more easily digestible, that keep people engaged. Because like,

422
00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:56,800
if you just kind of drone on about like, here's how to do X, Y, Z, here's all the benefits. People

423
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,240
like attention span are just shot these days. Like they're not going to sit through that.

424
00:41:00,240 --> 00:41:04,720
Like even 15 seconds is too much. Like they'll scroll away within the first three.

425
00:41:04,720 --> 00:41:11,760
Um, but I think comedy is one way, but it's again, it's like not everyone is funny and it's,

426
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:17,920
it's hard to say what people will find funny. Like if you are not a professional comedian,

427
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:23,920
I think there are some funny people on TikTok, but like not a bunch of like naturally funny ones.

428
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:29,440
I think a lot of it is scripted a hundred percent. Yeah. And, and obviously humor is going to reach

429
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:35,840
a lot of people, but it's so hard to be funny, you know? Um, so yeah, but I, I know exactly what

430
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:40,320
you're talking about. Yeah. That I think it's a really good skill when like a comedian is able to

431
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:46,320
have a message in their skit. Um, and it's a really good way to like reach an audience.

432
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:51,680
And I feel like a lot of comedians are on the rise on my FYP lately. I don't know if you've been

433
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:57,840
seeing it too. Like that Matt guy. I don't know. No, my FYP is full of like family guy skits right now.

434
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:06,880
So yeah, but comedy is kind of taking off right now. Yeah. Oh, I want to circle back to something

435
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:11,440
you mentioned earlier that that was kind of interesting. So the like love manifestation

436
00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:19,280
or something, could you get go a bit more into that? Yeah. I mean, so I, I mean, I've tried making

437
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:25,440
videos about numerous things that people are trying to manifest weight loss, you know, careers, what have

438
00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:31,440
you love is always going to be the thing that people are the most interested in. Um, and that was actually

439
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:36,400
like why I went viral in the beginning, um, was because I made tarot videos about love and relationships.

440
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:44,880
Um, and I think like, it's one of the most, I think love is one of the most misunderstood or hard to

441
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:54,720
like conceptualize or like quantify things of life. Like there's no set thing. Like if you got ghosted,

442
00:42:54,720 --> 00:42:59,040
like, you'll always wonder why you got ghosted and you always question it, but there's no like

443
00:42:59,040 --> 00:43:04,960
clear cut answer. You know, it's like, if the, you know, if your, um, business isn't doing well,

444
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:09,680
there might be a reason as to why it's more clear cut, but when things go wrong in love, it's like,

445
00:43:10,720 --> 00:43:17,440
oh, like, I don't know what it is. Um, and so I think a station gives people a lot of control in love,

446
00:43:18,240 --> 00:43:24,640
it seems. Um, and people, I think a lot of the times want that control in their love lives. So

447
00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:31,040
what I teach, um, you know, through the various methods that I make videos about and whatnot,

448
00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:37,840
it teaches people how to get their own control back in their life, love lives. Um, and a lot of

449
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:42,320
that stems from self-concept, kind of like what we've been talking about this whole time, which is

450
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:47,440
like something I preach is that the only way you'll ever change the behaviors of other people,

451
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:53,120
like your love interest is by changing your own view of yourself. So if you want them to think you're

452
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:57,360
more attractive, you have to think that you're attractive. And I mean, that's like basic common

453
00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:02,480
sense, but like sometimes just hearing it in the terms of manifestation just makes it click for

454
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:09,040
people. So, yeah. Yeah. Cause like what you talked about, a lot of it seems to stem from psychology,

455
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:12,800
like basic things like, oh, if you think you're more attractive, your body language is going to

456
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:17,760
show it, your tone of voice, and all of these contribute to your attractiveness. And as we've been

457
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:22,320
kind of talking about this entire time, it's all about the packaging or the messaging. It's like,

458
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:26,240
you can present this information in a bunch of different ways, but manifestation just seems to

459
00:44:26,240 --> 00:44:32,960
resonate a lot more with the female population. Exactly. Yeah. Um, and I think also part of it

460
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:39,840
is like with social media, you like, there's a lot of like trends, obviously, and things like that.

461
00:44:39,840 --> 00:44:44,640
So one thing that was really taking off for me was the whisper method. Like it's been featured in

462
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:50,000
like Glamour and Cosmo and all of this. Um, so yeah, that was like really successful. And I think just like

463
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:57,440
packaging ideas up into these bite-sized methods, um, and whatnot, it just like really resonates with

464
00:44:57,440 --> 00:45:04,480
people. And I see that in every niche on, uh, TikTok. Like, if you just have like the method,

465
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:09,760
people are way more likely to listen and, you know, actually, uh, follow whatever you're saying.

466
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:16,160
But yeah. Yeah. It's like, here are the XYZ hooks that you should use. Like, hey, here are the top

467
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:24,480
three things. Or like, let me tell you a secret. Or I read through a lot of them. Um, I found it's not

468
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:28,560
always that consistent. I find the list one is super consistent. I see some people who just,

469
00:45:29,120 --> 00:45:33,200
the entire account is that they're like, Hey, here's a top 10 XYZ. And you see that stuff on like

470
00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:41,040
BuzzFeed. Um, and I don't know, I haven't seen anyone who's made been able to consistently make

471
00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:46,720
like, uh, every single video with like one specific method, unless it's like a dance. Like if someone's

472
00:45:46,720 --> 00:45:52,880
known for like a dance, like that dance will always blow up. Um, but as far as like, have you seen that

473
00:45:52,880 --> 00:45:57,440
success? Like whenever you say, Oh, XYZ method, like those videos just consistently do well,

474
00:45:57,440 --> 00:46:02,160
or like what other hooks have you seen that kind of trend positively?

475
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:08,400
So I think anything that will, where you're going to tell them, like you'll get results

476
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:13,680
overnight or in a day, or here's how to manifest a text in one minute. That's always going to do

477
00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:20,080
really well because people love efficiency. Um, they love to see results right away. So that's first of

478
00:46:20,080 --> 00:46:26,240
all, um, anything that has like a method attached to it. That's simple to follow. People love that.

479
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:34,640
Um, I think, what is it? What else? Yeah. Like anything that gives them like a concrete, like,

480
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:40,480
you know, have a specific like end result in mind where they can, what it'll look like. That's been

481
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:44,960
successful. So saying, instead of saying, here's how to get communication from your ex or whatever,

482
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:50,000
to say, this is how you're going to manifest a call or a text or whatever it is. Um,

483
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:56,960
but lately what's been really popping off for me is just like talking about like, or like doing little

484
00:46:56,960 --> 00:47:02,000
snippet videos where I'm like, um, Oh my God, why can't I stop thinking about her blah, blah, blah. Turn

485
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:06,960
my head, the love letter method, you know, um, people love the sensational aspect of it. It's very

486
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:13,440
theatrical. I feel, um, and ritualistic. That's the other thing. It's like, people love a good ritual.

487
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:21,200
And I'm reading the 48 laws of power right now. And one of the laws of power. It's so good.

488
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:27,360
I don't like that. Yeah. I don't like it. Yeah. You say what you want. But, um, one of the things

489
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:35,040
he talks about is like how people love like a good ritual and like feeling like, you know,

490
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:39,200
like, yeah, they're part of something. Yeah. Yeah. Part of something. Exactly. Part of a movement.

491
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:44,080
So that's what I think it is, is people feel like they're part of like this

492
00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:51,760
movement in a sense that's benefiting them. So yeah. Yeah. I think what you said about the

493
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:56,000
focusing on the results makes a lot of sense. And like Apple employed this in all their marketing

494
00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:00,720
strategies. So like when Microsoft was trying to advertise their zoom, they're like, Hey, you have

495
00:48:01,680 --> 00:48:06,400
80 gigabytes of storage on this phone. And like to the consumer, they're like, yeah, all right. What does

496
00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:10,960
that mean? And Apple's like, Hey, you have 10,000 songs in the palm of your hand. And that's just

497
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:15,200
people like, Holy crap, 10,000 songs. They're like, they're saying the same thing, just packaged in a

498
00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:19,360
way where like one people are like, Oh, I want that thing. And the other ones that people are like,

499
00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:20,480
yeah, okay, whatever, I guess.

500
00:48:21,600 --> 00:48:25,120
That's a really good way to put it. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. TikTok's just like

501
00:48:25,840 --> 00:48:31,120
taking marketing and like putting in like a 15 second video. It's, it's all the same thing

502
00:48:31,120 --> 00:48:35,840
recycled. So yeah. But it's interesting to learn like what specifically does well.

503
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:42,880
And it takes a lot of like trial and error. Have you found like, like a strategy that works for you?

504
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:51,840
Um, so I have like a decent barometer for what will do well. Like if I wanted to strictly grow,

505
00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:56,640
if I wanted to just get the most followers possible, I would just post like the same

506
00:48:56,640 --> 00:49:01,120
three videos over and over again because they always do well. So like one is like teaching

507
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:06,080
people how to get a basically high-end tech job. Because like you said, if you focus on the result

508
00:49:06,080 --> 00:49:10,480
and then I'll be like, Hey, here are my credentials. Here's how you do it. And people will share like

509
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:17,120
crazy because well, one, they probably have friends in the industry or, and then the second video that

510
00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:23,440
always does well is sharing salary information. Um, and that's just because it's kind of like taboo to

511
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:31,040
talk about it within American culture or just society in general, where as like people don't

512
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:36,160
have a lot of insight into how much money people make. So when they're seeing like, Oh wow,

513
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:40,240
this guy's sharing salary information. And I've seen a lot of other creators also have those videos

514
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:44,960
consistently do well. It doesn't even have to be your own. It could also just be like salary progression

515
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:52,160
of like a nurse or a doctor or a lawyer or whatever, X, Y, Z. Um, and then the third type of video

516
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:57,600
that typically does well is if I tell a personal story, um, just because I think a lot of people

517
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:04,480
also share the experiences of like being an immigrant, being poor, and then seeing the success

518
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:09,120
that came out of that gives them either they can identify with it. They're in like the earlier stages

519
00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:13,600
or that gives them hope to see like, Oh, well, here's a person who came from like a similar

520
00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:17,680
background, similar situation, similar interests, whatever. And now that they've like, you know,

521
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:25,600
quote unquote made it. And, but I don't know how, like, I guess to more general, to generalize those,

522
00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:30,400
generalize those things. One is the first method is very similar to what you were kind of already

523
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:35,200
talking about is focusing on the results and then teaching people like, here's how you get it. Um,

524
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:43,600
and then the second one is more just like, I think more societal. I think if salary information

525
00:50:43,600 --> 00:50:48,800
was more publicly available, it wouldn't do well anymore. But you know, as a society, we're probably

526
00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:53,200
years away from that, if not decades. Um, and then the third one, as far as the story,

527
00:50:53,200 --> 00:50:57,920
I think stories will always be popular. And you see some of the top creators, they have blown up

528
00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:02,160
through stories like that's their content. And they're able to tell like very engaging stories

529
00:51:02,160 --> 00:51:08,480
of even the most mundane things. Um, I think that like right now, one of the, I'd say that Erica

530
00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:13,120
Titus is probably one of the top creators, like in the world right now, like, yeah, on the almost

531
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:20,000
on the level of like KSI. Yeah. And like, yeah. And I like, I don't understand the appeal as a guy.

532
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:24,800
I'm sure her, her audience is also like 90% female plus. And I was trying to ask my wife,

533
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:30,800
cause she's, she's super into Erica and her sister. Um, and I was like, what, what is the appeal?

534
00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:34,480
Like, I don't get it. Cause I've tried watching her videos and tried to like dissect, like,

535
00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:40,000
why does this have several million views? Like nothing, nothing happened in this video. Like,

536
00:51:40,000 --> 00:51:43,520
there's no knowledge transfer. There's nothing. She's like, oh, it's like, it's cause they're messed

537
00:51:43,520 --> 00:51:46,880
up. And I'm like, what, like, what do you mean? It's like, oh, cause they're like normal people.

538
00:51:46,880 --> 00:51:50,960
They're messed up. They have flaws and like, it's comforting in a sense. And I'm like, huh,

539
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:59,840
that's very interesting. Cause like, I can't see an equivalent male creator ever reaching that

540
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:05,840
heights from the same appeal. Cause like guys, they want to see people in like very high status

541
00:52:05,840 --> 00:52:11,680
position, like super rich or wealthy or famous or popular or whatever. And they're kind of their way

542
00:52:11,680 --> 00:52:15,200
of manifesting is they're in their minds. They're thinking like, oh, I'm going to be like this guy

543
00:52:15,200 --> 00:52:19,600
in the future. Like I'm going to have this status or this wealth or this popularity that I don't

544
00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:24,640
currently have. Um, whereas on the exact opposite end of the spectrum, now we have Erica Titus. It's

545
00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:30,560
like, she's not that well-spoken. She's just like kind of normal in a lot of ways, I guess. But then

546
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:33,760
people are like, oh, I love that. Like I identify with that. Like, this is great content. Like,

547
00:52:33,760 --> 00:52:38,320
let me consume it. Um, but I don't know what your thoughts are on that.

548
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:43,040
She's so engaging. I don't know what it is, but when I, you know, when she pops up on my FYP,

549
00:52:43,040 --> 00:52:46,720
it's like, I don't even care what the story is, but I'm just like tuned in. And I don't,

550
00:52:47,840 --> 00:52:52,240
I don't know if it's like the way she starts it off or it's, I think it's the fruit to be honest.

551
00:52:52,240 --> 00:52:57,120
Cause I noticed that videos without fruit don't do as well, but like, maybe it's like the meeting to

552
00:52:57,120 --> 00:53:02,800
see it, you know, be fully cut open or whatever. Or like a lot of women, um, on my FYP are really

553
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:06,960
successful when they do like, get ready with me videos. And so you just almost want to stick

554
00:53:06,960 --> 00:53:11,200
around to the end just to see their full face of makeup. But you're also there for the story,

555
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:17,520
you know? Um, but yeah, she's very engaging. And I think going back to what you were saying about,

556
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:25,600
um, like the way that men are operating versus women, it's like, it goes back to like the competitive

557
00:53:25,600 --> 00:53:30,880
and challenge aspect for men. It's like, they have to be that man. Whereas for women, it's very,

558
00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:36,800
like we're all kind of friends. We're all sisters, you know, we all work together to get to a certain

559
00:53:36,800 --> 00:53:41,760
place. Um, we have to relate to each other, which is why I think a lot of relatable content as well

560
00:53:41,760 --> 00:53:47,200
for women in the storytelling niche. Um, but yeah, storytelling is in, and I have to say,

561
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:52,960
that's why I really was drawn to your content because I resonate so much with your story of like being an

562
00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:58,720
immigrant, being broke and then getting out of it, you know? So it works. And I'm not even into like,

563
00:53:58,720 --> 00:54:06,240
per se, computer science or any of that stuff. Um, but your story was like what resonated with me.

564
00:54:06,240 --> 00:54:08,960
And I love your content. I have to say, I'm a huge fan.

565
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:15,680
Thanks. Yeah. I think it's, it's much more common than people think like being poor and then not being

566
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:22,320
poor. And it's like the classic American dream. And, um, even if it's becoming more rare nowadays,

567
00:54:22,320 --> 00:54:27,440
like if you actually look at the stats, social mobility is like lower than it's traditionally

568
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:33,120
been. It's actually trending down. Um, unfortunately, but like people want to believe in it. Like they

569
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:39,600
want this to be possible. And I think like, in a sense, it's almost like providing hope,

570
00:54:39,600 --> 00:54:44,640
like similar to like the manifestation. It's like you're, you're manifesting, uh, but you're also

571
00:54:45,280 --> 00:54:49,600
given a glimpse of like the future. It's like, Hey, this is possible. Like it's,

572
00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:53,440
you know, I don't have to stay poor forever. I don't have to be like this broke immigrant.

573
00:54:53,440 --> 00:54:58,880
Like, you know, here's someone who did it. Here's exactly. Yeah, exactly. It's exactly.

574
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:03,680
I'm telling you, we're all saying the same thing, but in different packaging, different font. Like,

575
00:55:03,680 --> 00:55:10,080
like, I think when you're able to visualize yourself as that person and change, do the identity

576
00:55:10,080 --> 00:55:15,360
transformation and the self-concept work where you're like, I'm no longer going to like, that's

577
00:55:15,360 --> 00:55:22,560
not my story to tell anymore. Like, that's what the, uh, that's when I flipped the switch or yeah,

578
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:28,000
whatever was when I was like, I'm so sick and tired of telling myself this story that I'm a broke

579
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:32,560
immigrant, that I can't afford college, that like, that's my destiny. I'm going to be a broke team.

580
00:55:32,560 --> 00:55:37,600
No, like I said, starting today, that's not my story to tell anymore. And, you know,

581
00:55:37,600 --> 00:55:43,520
I started seeing videos on my FYP of like your story and whoever else's story. And I was like,

582
00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:50,160
if he could do it, I can do it. You know, what's stopping me. Um, and then what you were saying

583
00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:55,200
about like the social mobility thing, I think it's really interesting because I'm noticing,

584
00:55:55,200 --> 00:56:00,080
you know, obviously I'm graduating college and I'm noticing with a lot of my friends,

585
00:56:00,080 --> 00:56:04,880
they're really struggling to get jobs, people who have, you know, master's degrees, things like that.

586
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:09,920
But then on the other, you know, the flip side, I'm also in the realm of social media. And I'm feeling,

587
00:56:09,920 --> 00:56:17,440
I feel like that's the new like method of social mobility. That's like taking off right now

588
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:24,000
is like, if you can get social media and start your own business, your life can change overnight.

589
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:29,440
And I don't think that's possible in any other way, really. I mean, maybe computer science,

590
00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:36,240
actually, um, is the closest thing in a nine to five cents to that. But I'm seeing so many people

591
00:56:36,240 --> 00:56:41,920
that I know take the media and start their own businesses and have that social mobility. So I

592
00:56:41,920 --> 00:56:48,480
feel like that's, what's going to be the next thing. Yeah, definitely content creation is on its way

593
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:52,720
up. Like there's a ton of VC money flowing into the space. There's like five different like tree

594
00:56:52,720 --> 00:57:00,800
competitors that will do effectively the same thing. And I read a stat that in 2021, if something

595
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:06,000
like 1% of the entire population considers themselves a content creator or has like made content of

596
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:12,080
some form, whether that's like a YouTube video and TikTok or what have you. Um, and that number is

597
00:57:12,080 --> 00:57:17,680
probably going to go up. And like, I remember 10, maybe 15 years ago, I'm like, I'm pretty old. I'm

598
00:57:17,680 --> 00:57:24,320
in my thirties. And it was really frowned upon to have your public persona on the internet. People were

599
00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:27,280
like, Hey, don't put your information out there. It's going to get stolen. You're going to get your

600
00:57:27,280 --> 00:57:32,320
identity hijacked. And now like people have their entire lives out there, like all their tweets going

601
00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:37,920
back to when they were being racist. Cause I, that used to be a really in thing. Like if you dig up

602
00:57:37,920 --> 00:57:42,000
people's old tweets, you're probably going to find some trash in there. That's not acceptable by today's

603
00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:46,560
societal standards, but back then we're like, everyone was doing it. Um, so I think it's,

604
00:57:47,520 --> 00:57:51,440
I don't know. I think it's going to be a really interesting future. Cause like thinking about in

605
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:56,960
like 10, 20 years when my kids see the stuff that I'm making now, like, that's just a really weird

606
00:57:56,960 --> 00:58:01,360
thought. Like, I don't, I kind of don't want them to see it. Cause I feel like a lot of the stuff that

607
00:58:01,360 --> 00:58:08,240
I say now, obviously it's going to be horrible, but like just complete cancelable type content in,

608
00:58:08,240 --> 00:58:12,640
you know, 20 years where people are like, wow, Frank was such a bigot for saying X, Y, Z.

609
00:58:12,640 --> 00:58:18,000
Um, and that's because kind of just like society moves and views that were previously okay are

610
00:58:18,800 --> 00:58:25,600
kind of become outdated, uh, you know, for good reasons. But, um, it's interesting that you,

611
00:58:26,480 --> 00:58:34,240
you said about the, um, social media being one of the ways to like break through the societal

612
00:58:35,680 --> 00:58:42,160
walls, because I think that a lot of people underestimate three things. And it's like

613
00:58:42,160 --> 00:58:47,120
basically the types of leverage you can have as an individual. So if you think about like the downfall

614
00:58:47,120 --> 00:58:51,920
of a nine to five, it's essentially because you only have 24 hours per day. And so if you're only

615
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:57,920
leveraging your own manpower, like you'll never, you can't, you might become pseudo wealthy.

616
00:58:57,920 --> 00:59:02,800
Like you might be a lawyer or a doctor or engineer and get paid like a decent amount,

617
00:59:02,800 --> 00:59:09,920
but you can kind of like upgrade your lifestyle along with it. And your compensation will grow

618
00:59:09,920 --> 00:59:15,840
linearly, but never exponentially. Um, and then, so the three forms of leverage, like one is manpower.

619
00:59:15,840 --> 00:59:19,040
And this is the common one. This is why everyone wants to be a manager. Like, oh,

620
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:23,520
I want people working under me. It's like, so now instead of me just doing work, I now have like

621
00:59:23,520 --> 00:59:28,480
three people or five people or, you know, an entire department of minions, essentially doing

622
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:33,680
stuff that I want to. Um, and that only works in a business sense because unless you're the business

623
00:59:33,680 --> 00:59:38,800
owner, you're not actually controlling the fruit of that labor. Like that goes to the shareholders.

624
00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:42,880
Um, but it does work if you have a business and then like the second form of leverage is money. So

625
00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:48,320
capitalistic society, money is always going to be the king. Um, people, someone actually wrote a really

626
00:59:48,320 --> 00:59:54,640
in-depth technical book about it saying how your salary will never outpace a rich person's just like

627
00:59:54,640 --> 01:00:00,800
accumulation of wealth is uses way to make money is to have it. And then three, um, third form of

628
01:00:00,800 --> 01:00:05,920
leverage is like technology. So this encompasses both like coding and social media and like marketing,

629
01:00:05,920 --> 01:00:10,640
basically anything that you're able to replicate infinitely for a very low cost. So like whether

630
01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:15,280
that's a TikTok or YouTube video, or if you're writing like a blog post even, or even like this

631
01:00:15,280 --> 01:00:20,320
podcast, right? Like you make it once, it can be consumed hundreds, millions of times, no additional

632
01:00:20,320 --> 01:00:26,160
efforts. Um, and that's why software still falls within that realm of like good careers to pursue

633
01:00:26,160 --> 01:00:30,560
because just like social media, once you learn how to code, once you write software, you have this

634
01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:35,840
tireless worker that will always do what it tells you. Like it's not going to quit on you. It's never

635
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:40,480
going to like fall apart assuming you coded it correctly. Um, and I think a lot of people

636
01:00:41,440 --> 01:00:46,160
don't quite understand that because people are still fed the whole age old story of like,

637
01:00:46,160 --> 01:00:52,000
Hey, study hard, go to college, get a job, uh, but not really understanding like how money works

638
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:57,520
or how to gain leverage out of your own time without just kind of working for one company forever.

639
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:04,080
Exactly. Couldn't have said it better. And that's, I mean, obviously for me, that's like really

640
01:01:04,080 --> 01:01:09,440
relevant because I was fed that story. And that's like the only thing I believed like going into college

641
01:01:09,440 --> 01:01:16,240
and two years ago. So like my sophomore year was when I, you know, blew up on social media.

642
01:01:16,240 --> 01:01:21,680
And I still thought like, even when I was making like a teacher's salary, I was like,

643
01:01:22,800 --> 01:01:28,960
you know, things can change this and that. And I think, um, one thing I noticed that society just

644
01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:34,560
continues to push is this idea that like, like $10,000 a month is like a lot of money, you know,

645
01:01:34,560 --> 01:01:41,040
like, and, and that, like, I think we have a very like capped mindset around money. Like there's a,

646
01:01:41,040 --> 01:01:46,480
like, we have a limited belief around money. Like, how do I say it? Like not a deficit mindset,

647
01:01:46,480 --> 01:01:52,000
but more so like, uh, like there's just a cap on money. It's not unlimited.

648
01:01:52,000 --> 01:01:54,400
There's like one pie instead of infinite pies.

649
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:59,600
Exactly. Exactly. But once you shift your mindset to like an abundance mindset where you're like,

650
01:01:59,600 --> 01:02:07,120
money is literally infinite, um, essentially. Um, and you know, when you're working a job in social

651
01:02:07,120 --> 01:02:11,680
media or you run your own business, it like, you start to see it, you start to see it. You're like,

652
01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:16,880
it is unlimited. It's it, I can essentially make however much I want. It just depends on,

653
01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:22,000
you know, a number of factors, but the potential is there. Whereas when you're working a nine to five,

654
01:02:22,000 --> 01:02:25,200
obviously there's a cap. And I think that's why we have such a limited mindset around money.

655
01:02:25,200 --> 01:02:32,480
Um, but yeah, it's, it's a very new thing for me. And it's, it's just, I never thought I'd be one of

656
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:37,920
those people to be like passive income or F a nine to five. I've really never thought I would. And

657
01:02:37,920 --> 01:02:44,080
then it's like, you get thrown into running your own business and it's like, wow, like this is

658
01:02:44,080 --> 01:02:50,400
incredible. And the freedom it affords you in life is priceless in my opinion. Um, I think that's a

659
01:02:50,400 --> 01:02:56,400
phenomenon. A lot of younger creators are facing right now is like, we're very young and we're

660
01:02:56,400 --> 01:03:02,320
forced to deal with running a business, you know, when we maybe never even intended to in our lifetimes.

661
01:03:02,320 --> 01:03:07,200
Um, and it's, I mean, it's a blessing, but it's very difficult, you know, because if you don't have

662
01:03:07,200 --> 01:03:12,240
someone to look up to when it comes to that, it is, it's, it's hard figuring out the ropes. What is an

663
01:03:12,240 --> 01:03:17,120
LLC? How do taxes work when your friends are still in college? You know, it's not easy.

664
01:03:17,920 --> 01:03:23,840
Um, but yeah. And I also think, uh, you know, you were talking about like kids earlier. Um,

665
01:03:23,840 --> 01:03:27,920
I never even thought about that. And that like really made me think like, oh my God,

666
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:33,120
what are my kids going to think when they see me on like TikTok? I never thought about that. I mean,

667
01:03:33,120 --> 01:03:36,880
obviously that's like down the line, but yeah. How old are your kids?

668
01:03:36,880 --> 01:03:42,320
Uh, they're both below five. I don't want to like to share like too many specific people.

669
01:03:42,320 --> 01:03:42,720
They're younger.

670
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:47,680
Okay. So there's some time there, but yeah, like one day your kids are going to see your

671
01:03:47,680 --> 01:03:53,200
stuff on social media and that's, that's crazy. Like that's the new reality right now that we're

672
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:57,280
kind of getting into. Cause back in the day you were right. Like back in the day, I feel like people

673
01:03:57,280 --> 01:04:01,680
didn't really share much on social media if they were content creators and it was almost very like

674
01:04:02,400 --> 01:04:06,720
made fun of kind of to be a content creator. It wasn't a normalized thing. And now it's

675
01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:12,800
trendy now. Like, I mean, especially in my age demographic, like you'll know, like a handful

676
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:18,560
of friends who are like making content, you know, or TikTokers or stuff like that's so common now.

677
01:04:18,560 --> 01:04:23,600
Like now having a million followers on TikTok is like seen as nothing, you know? And that's crazy.

678
01:04:24,480 --> 01:04:27,360
But yeah, it is insane.

679
01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:32,240
Yeah. And it's crazy that you mentioned how it's like mostly the young demographic because it's like,

680
01:04:32,240 --> 01:04:37,280
I've been on calls with, um, people wanting me to like bring me in as like a social media

681
01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:41,440
consultant. And it's like, you have to explain so many of these basic things. Cause like the things

682
01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:45,440
that you learned over the past two years through trial and error, like these large businesses have

683
01:04:45,440 --> 01:04:49,360
no idea how to do. And it's like, they have to hire people who are younger because of the one,

684
01:04:49,360 --> 01:04:53,440
they're the ones who are making the content. They're the ones who are in tune with how

685
01:04:53,440 --> 01:04:58,160
to make good engaging content, especially like, I feel like the old style of content

686
01:04:58,160 --> 01:05:03,360
really does not work well on TikTok. Like it could still work on like YouTube or like Instagram,

687
01:05:03,360 --> 01:05:07,680
but those, I mean, YouTube will be around forever, but Instagram is kind of dying out. Like they're

688
01:05:07,680 --> 01:05:15,280
trying to move to reels. Reels sucks. I don't know who watches reels. Like, um, but what you were saying

689
01:05:15,280 --> 01:05:20,800
about like having that group of friends who are all content creators, like that's wild to me because

690
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:26,720
I never thought I would do social media. Honestly, it was something that I kind of just

691
01:05:26,720 --> 01:05:35,120
stayed away from my entire life. Um, and so I guess it's crazy to see like how many young people are so

692
01:05:37,600 --> 01:05:44,240
have so much expertise already. And it's like, it's such a niche, not niche, uh, new industry that

693
01:05:44,240 --> 01:05:52,640
people, a lot of the old methods and technology or methods and strategies to go viral don't

694
01:05:52,640 --> 01:05:58,480
necessarily work on TikTok. Like I saw this. So like my friend who has a startup, he like hired this

695
01:05:58,480 --> 01:06:05,600
company to make them like a really fancy ad spent like mid five figures and it was complete garbage.

696
01:06:05,600 --> 01:06:11,440
Like it looks very, it looks like an ad, right? It's not genuine. Like people see that. And like,

697
01:06:11,440 --> 01:06:16,080
when you see sponsored posts by these large corporations, they have like likes in the hundreds

698
01:06:16,640 --> 01:06:22,720
and then there's like five comments and one of them, and it's just like, it's very pathetic almost

699
01:06:22,720 --> 01:06:27,200
in a way. It's like, you can't do something that like probably some teenagers is going to blow this

700
01:06:27,200 --> 01:06:33,520
ad out of the water and you can pay them like much less to do it. Exactly. It's the influence,

701
01:06:33,520 --> 01:06:39,120
the potential influence that is in the hands of youth right now is insane. And I feel like no one's

702
01:06:39,120 --> 01:06:46,640
talking about it. Like how many people, uh, young people can reach, you know? Um, it is really insane.

703
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:51,040
Cause I think like, we both can relate that we just never saw ourselves in social media and like

704
01:06:51,040 --> 01:06:57,280
overnight people are like becoming the authority on certain topics. Like you're, I would say,

705
01:06:57,280 --> 01:07:04,080
an authority on, you know, computer science careers and things like that. Um, you know, I became an

706
01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:10,000
authority, so to speak on manifestation. Like, did I ever intend to, I mean, I had no idea. Um,

707
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:17,840
and so that's insane. Like it's very, um, fast paced too. You know, because I feel like most people

708
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:23,520
who start their own businesses or do become authorities on something, it happens over the span of like,

709
01:07:23,520 --> 01:07:27,840
let's say 10 years, you know, most people don't run their own business successfully till they're in

710
01:07:27,840 --> 01:07:33,600
their like thirties, forties. Um, but now you're seeing so many young people with like heaps of money

711
01:07:34,720 --> 01:07:38,480
because something blew up overnight and they're able to market it much better. Like you said,

712
01:07:38,480 --> 01:07:47,360
than any corporation. Um, so it is insane. It is. Yeah. And I think it's only going to like

713
01:07:47,360 --> 01:07:54,240
continue to grow. Um, I, I challenge the statistics. I think that we're still like an anomaly. So you

714
01:07:54,240 --> 01:07:58,000
mentioned that like a million followers is nothing. And I totally agree with that statement. Like it's

715
01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:03,520
like people, there's like hundreds of thousands of creators. I just like, I look at people's profiles

716
01:08:03,520 --> 01:08:07,440
and like the people I've never seen just have like millions and millions of followers. And like,

717
01:08:07,440 --> 01:08:12,880
I've never seen them a single time on TikTok. Um, so there's like billions of people watching TikTok.

718
01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:17,760
Uh, and there's, you know, millions of creators with just a huge following that it's, it's so hard to

719
01:08:17,760 --> 01:08:21,920
see all the content because there's so much. Um, but I still think that like, if you were to go into the

720
01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:29,920
percentages, I bet like 95% of people who create content are probably like sub 10,000 followers would be my

721
01:08:29,920 --> 01:08:36,240
guess. Yeah, I would agree with that. I mean, we're definitely outsiders or, you know, an anomaly,

722
01:08:36,240 --> 01:08:42,400
but I do think it's becoming more common now. And well, also I would say like having 10,000 followers

723
01:08:42,400 --> 01:08:48,000
is still a lot of influence, you know, the fact that so many people have that because of TikTok now

724
01:08:48,640 --> 01:08:54,080
is pretty insane. Like not a lot of people had that on Instagram or YouTube as much. Um,

725
01:08:54,080 --> 01:08:59,520
so it is a really interesting, like, I'm excited to see what that turns into down the line and how

726
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:04,240
that influences things like politics or, you know, God knows what, but yeah.

727
01:09:04,240 --> 01:09:09,280
Yeah. Yeah. I think that young people are definitely, like you said, going to have a much greater voice

728
01:09:09,280 --> 01:09:14,320
going forward, uh, because the majority of content creators are young. Like I would say,

729
01:09:14,320 --> 01:09:18,720
again, going back to that distribution, probably like 80, 20, like 80% are probably in their twenties.

730
01:09:18,720 --> 01:09:25,840
And then the rest are like old people like me, but we're very rare. And yeah, I mean, it's like,

731
01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:29,920
as far as politics goes so far, it's always favored old people because they vote more. Um,

732
01:09:29,920 --> 01:09:34,320
but more recently I've been seeing a lot of positive TikToks from younger people telling

733
01:09:34,320 --> 01:09:38,400
people like, Hey, like, you know, shut up. If you were complaining about things and you're not voting,

734
01:09:38,400 --> 01:09:43,120
like you're part of the problem. You are the problem. You need to go vote. And I've seen many

735
01:09:43,120 --> 01:09:47,360
TikToks from really, really large, um, younger content creators, basically telling people to vote,

736
01:09:47,360 --> 01:09:51,760
not like any, any specific way. Right. But just telling them to do the act of voting,

737
01:09:51,760 --> 01:09:58,160
which people have not done historically. Yeah. And the white house inviting a bunch of TikTokers over

738
01:09:58,160 --> 01:10:03,600
to do TikToks at the white house. Like it's, it's a thing now. It's a thing. The youth are

739
01:10:03,600 --> 01:10:08,480
gaining influence in politics, I think through social media. And I feel like over time, that's

740
01:10:08,480 --> 01:10:14,720
going to have like a larger impact. I think statistically speaking, like young people still vote less than

741
01:10:14,720 --> 01:10:20,800
older people regardless, but, um, that might change over time. And I think that's going to be really

742
01:10:20,800 --> 01:10:26,160
interesting. Yeah. And then like young people have always dictated the culture, but then you,

743
01:10:26,160 --> 01:10:33,200
as you mentioned before, now the speed at which it transitions or changes is so quick. Like a year

744
01:10:33,200 --> 01:10:39,440
ago I had literally zero social media presence. Um, but then like the TikTok algorithm. And as far as

745
01:10:39,440 --> 01:10:46,160
like the competitors for reels and like YouTube shorts, I don't think they're anywhere near TikTok. Like

746
01:10:46,160 --> 01:10:54,080
the algorithm on those platforms is, it's just like leagues and leagues behind. It's not even close.

747
01:10:54,080 --> 01:10:57,840
And there's just like the UI it's like, it's like an afterthought, right? Cause like these platforms

748
01:10:57,840 --> 01:11:02,720
were not built for short form media. Like YouTube was long form and like search based, like Google,

749
01:11:02,720 --> 01:11:07,680
right there, the whole thing is search that you want to make long searchable content. And then for

750
01:11:07,680 --> 01:11:13,200
Instagram is more almost like celebrity worship or like this kind of more put together persona.

751
01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:19,360
Like the, it's interesting to see the content, what does well on each of the platforms. Cause like

752
01:11:19,360 --> 01:11:23,920
none, most of the content that does well on TikTok for me, like does not do well on reels. Cause I

753
01:11:23,920 --> 01:11:29,040
think the audience is a lot older. So like, they don't care about, um, computer science. Cause they

754
01:11:29,040 --> 01:11:33,840
already have a career in XYZ. Like they're past that point of choosing. They're interested in like,

755
01:11:33,840 --> 01:11:39,120
well, how do I get a promotion? How do I get a raise? How here's, what's something that like

756
01:11:39,120 --> 01:11:45,680
actually is applicable to me. Um, and then YouTube is just like, I think longer form is still king.

757
01:11:45,680 --> 01:11:48,880
Like, I don't think it'll ever really transition to a short form platform.

758
01:11:50,000 --> 01:11:56,240
Exactly. Yeah. And I think that's what makes YouTube unique. Um, and it'll always when I think,

759
01:11:56,240 --> 01:12:02,160
yeah, it is interesting to see like what does, or I mean, TikTok specifically, just the algorithm is

760
01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:09,120
insane. What it's able to accomplish. I completely agree. Yeah. It's, and then like reels, you have

761
01:12:09,120 --> 01:12:13,600
to kind of like pick and choose specifically what you know will do well on reels. Cause it's not

762
01:12:13,600 --> 01:12:18,960
the same things I've noticed on reels. The videos that do really well for me on reels are things that

763
01:12:18,960 --> 01:12:25,920
were popping off on TikTok a year ago. Old trends. Well, yeah. Yeah. But

764
01:12:26,240 --> 01:12:31,280
I don't know. Yeah. I think it's like the, the speed of culture. So before it was always kind

765
01:12:31,280 --> 01:12:37,040
of a meme, how like 4chan was like the incubator of memes. And then eventually when it got old and

766
01:12:37,040 --> 01:12:41,360
stale, it moved to Reddit. And then once that got old and stale, it moved kind of to other platforms

767
01:12:41,360 --> 01:12:47,200
like Instagram and then Facebook and Twitter or whatever. Uh, but nowadays it's like something

768
01:12:47,200 --> 01:12:51,360
can be around for like a week or two or a month and then it's old by the next month.

769
01:12:51,360 --> 01:13:01,440
Um, but it's exactly. Yeah. Yeah. I was going to ask you, um, what made you decide to post your

770
01:13:01,440 --> 01:13:06,720
first TikTok? Cause you were saying like, you just had like zero social media like following or anything

771
01:13:06,720 --> 01:13:12,720
like that a year ago. So what was it that made you do it? So, so hilarious is this, this ties into the

772
01:13:12,720 --> 01:13:19,600
entire conversation we've been having. Um, and it was due to competition. So my wife made a TikTok

773
01:13:19,600 --> 01:13:24,560
and she was bragging to me and being like, Oh my God, check out my followers. She had a couple of

774
01:13:24,560 --> 01:13:30,160
thousand. And one day I just decided like, okay, you know what? I'm going to create my own account

775
01:13:30,160 --> 01:13:35,520
and I'm going to pass you like before I ended the year. So this was last December. Um, and then one of

776
01:13:35,520 --> 01:13:41,600
my first couple of videos took off, I think all first, the first three, they all got over a million views.

777
01:13:41,600 --> 01:13:48,160
One of them hit like 10 million views. Um, and I hit like, I don't know, a hundred K

778
01:13:48,880 --> 01:13:53,440
within the first like week and then like 300 K within like the first month.

779
01:13:53,440 --> 01:13:58,240
And I got like a bunch of interviews from like wall street journal, business insider. Um,

780
01:13:59,920 --> 01:14:03,200
I forget what other ones, but there's like all this attention all at once.

781
01:14:03,200 --> 01:14:07,200
But like ever since then it was essentially like a rocket. And then it's kind of just been like slowly

782
01:14:07,680 --> 01:14:13,360
down since there. Like it's very, very slow since then. So it's like basically all the growth happened

783
01:14:13,360 --> 01:14:17,760
in like those first three months. And then I just kept on continuing to post because like

784
01:14:18,720 --> 01:14:23,040
I, outside of this, like basically just look after my family. And I think a lot of people are surprised

785
01:14:23,040 --> 01:14:29,440
whenever they see Annie's blogs. Um, and then of course I shouted out her account and she was

786
01:14:29,440 --> 01:14:33,760
extremely happy about that. She's always been super into social media, like to the point of annoyance

787
01:14:33,760 --> 01:14:39,120
for me. Cause like she'd be like the Instagram person of like trying to take a picture of our food.

788
01:14:39,120 --> 01:14:42,160
And I'm like, ah, I just want to eat this food. Like I don't, I don't care about this.

789
01:14:42,160 --> 01:14:49,520
I love her videos by the way. Oh yeah. I'm a huge fan. Yeah. I love her. Yeah. I think her, um,

790
01:14:49,520 --> 01:14:56,160
videos have done really well, uh, compared to what she was doing before and like her food,

791
01:14:56,160 --> 01:15:02,000
her food videos have taken off and like her vlog videos do okay. Um, I'm trying to push her towards

792
01:15:02,000 --> 01:15:06,960
more of the food content, but that also takes like a really long time to make. Cause like my video will

793
01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:13,360
take literally a minute or less, but her video will take like an entire day and we have other stuff to

794
01:15:13,360 --> 01:15:20,560
do. Right. Well, that's so interesting that it was a competition that fueled your passion or your,

795
01:15:20,560 --> 01:15:26,880
the start of your TikTok. Yeah. It all goes back to instinct, like I said. Um, but that's so crazy.

796
01:15:26,880 --> 01:15:34,800
Yeah. And these videos are really good. I love her. Um, but it's, I think it's nice in terms of our

797
01:15:34,800 --> 01:15:40,640
content that it is very easy and, um, we can turn, you know, have quick turnaround. Um, because yeah,

798
01:15:40,640 --> 01:15:46,240
some people have to spend like hours on their videos and that's, that's tough. Um, but yeah,

799
01:15:46,240 --> 01:15:50,800
we're lucky. Yeah. I think it's, it also depends on the creator. Cause like,

800
01:15:50,800 --> 01:15:55,680
there are certain accounts that like every single video is pretty much destined to go viral. Like

801
01:15:55,680 --> 01:16:00,800
a lot of the special effects ones that I see, um, very engaging. I don't know if this guy's posted

802
01:16:00,800 --> 01:16:07,120
in a while, but he would do like anime edits. And because I think anime that like niche is extreme,

803
01:16:07,120 --> 01:16:13,920
anything that piggybacks off an existing cultural phenomenon is kind of destined to do well. So all

804
01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:19,360
the people who talk about like movies or TV, um, a lot of anime accounts, whether they're doing like

805
01:16:19,360 --> 01:16:26,080
parodies or comedy or simply just like commentary, I think that it's because you already have that

806
01:16:26,080 --> 01:16:31,280
audience and people are interested in this subject. Um, similar to like food in a sense,

807
01:16:31,280 --> 01:16:35,920
though. I think, I feel like the food market is kind of oversaturated because it's like something,

808
01:16:35,920 --> 01:16:39,840
it's a very common hobby. Um, not to say that you like can't do well, but I feel like

809
01:16:40,640 --> 01:16:48,240
the top food people, they all have like a twist. So like the old grandma, I, I don't know her name,

810
01:16:48,240 --> 01:16:52,640
but, um, I think she got nominated for like one of the best creators or something recently.

811
01:16:52,640 --> 01:16:58,080
Okay. Ninja. That's right. She's popular because her like grandson does her edits. Like she does the

812
01:16:58,080 --> 01:17:04,640
cooking, but her grandson does all the comments and the edits. And that's why it like pops off because

813
01:17:04,640 --> 01:17:10,960
it's a young person who knows what other young people will like. Um, exactly. And Emily Mariko was

814
01:17:10,960 --> 01:17:19,120
taking off too. Yeah. She, she moved really fast. Yeah. I mean, I'm, I feel like the whole growth phase,

815
01:17:19,120 --> 01:17:23,200
I'm not sure if this is a real thing or not. I feel like it happens the most within the first year.

816
01:17:23,200 --> 01:17:29,360
Um, I don't know if you've seen that as well. Yes, for sure. Like the first year was, it was insane.

817
01:17:29,360 --> 01:17:35,040
Like how fast, um, things were moving. And then obviously you have that plateau and no one talks

818
01:17:35,040 --> 01:17:41,280
about this, but it's hard to deal with that. Like the, the dopamine rush that you have when things are

819
01:17:41,280 --> 01:17:46,560
doing really well and your content's booming and then you hit that plateau and it's like,

820
01:17:47,200 --> 01:17:51,840
it's not easy. It's really difficult. And obviously I feel like the algorithm is kind of taking like

821
01:17:51,840 --> 01:17:56,960
a gambling approach on it. Um, they know what it's doing to your psychology. They know it's going to

822
01:17:56,960 --> 01:18:02,800
force you to make more content to get that dopamine again. But like, I've really struggled with that

823
01:18:02,800 --> 01:18:09,520
because I have ADHD as well. So for me, I need that dopamine and I would like obsessed with making

824
01:18:09,520 --> 01:18:15,920
content until I would have that dopamine hit one more time, you know? Um, but I really feel like I

825
01:18:15,920 --> 01:18:21,600
became addicted to it. Like, I feel like a lot of people probably relate, but it's like, it really is

826
01:18:21,600 --> 01:18:27,360
like a drug. It is because the validation you feel from it. And that's something I had to work on too.

827
01:18:27,360 --> 01:18:32,800
Cause like, I'm a spiritual creator. I don't want, um, my, the thing that's fueling me to ever be

828
01:18:32,800 --> 01:18:39,120
ego or likes or comments or views or whatever. I don't want validation from that. I want validation

829
01:18:39,120 --> 01:18:44,800
from like actually helping people, but the algorithm makes it so hard because it's like all you want.

830
01:18:44,800 --> 01:18:48,560
It's all you can think about. I don't know about you, but it like consumed my whole life.

831
01:18:48,560 --> 01:18:53,840
It was my every waking thought. I think that's a super common story. And especially in the way they

832
01:18:53,840 --> 01:18:57,920
present the analytics. Cause like they show you the week over week and it's down. You'd like,

833
01:18:57,920 --> 01:19:01,840
see all these red arrows pointing down. You see all these numbers going down. And when it's a good

834
01:19:01,840 --> 01:19:05,600
week, you see all these numbers going up. It shows you all your top performing videos. It shows

835
01:19:05,600 --> 01:19:09,760
how well they performed over the past week. It shows your follower growth week over week. Like,

836
01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:15,040
Hey, are you doing better than like last month or this other random time period? Um,

837
01:19:15,040 --> 01:19:20,800
but pro tip and some creators have already figured this out, but if you create new accounts,

838
01:19:21,440 --> 01:19:23,600
it kind of resets that like lottery

839
01:19:25,520 --> 01:19:31,440
aspect of it. So my theory is essentially that within your first dozen or so videos,

840
01:19:31,440 --> 01:19:35,840
it'll kind of artificially pump out to give you try to try to get you hooked on that dopamine.

841
01:19:36,320 --> 01:19:40,800
Um, and pump out one of these videos and make it a super viral video. So basically like

842
01:19:40,800 --> 01:19:44,160
if you create a new account and one of your first 12 videos don't blow up to like a million,

843
01:19:44,160 --> 01:19:48,640
then you can just kind of like, you know, roll the dice again, pull the lever again. And that's why I

844
01:19:48,640 --> 01:19:54,640
think some people have like four or five accounts and all of them are like super big. Um, but like

845
01:19:54,640 --> 01:20:00,000
the plateau you talking about, I'd be really interested to see the analytics of growth for

846
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:05,280
creators. Cause like my hypothesis is that a lot of that growth actually happens within the first year.

847
01:20:05,280 --> 01:20:11,360
And then everyone plateaus. Okay. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. I'm interested in seeing like

848
01:20:12,240 --> 01:20:18,480
a much bigger creators, like, um, Anna Sitar, I think is her name or like any of the creators that

849
01:20:18,480 --> 01:20:24,960
have like 10 million, um, followers. Like, yeah. Like how are they continuously growing? Because I mean,

850
01:20:24,960 --> 01:20:31,520
I imagine they have to be because they couldn't have gained 10 million in a year. So I'm curious

851
01:20:31,520 --> 01:20:35,520
what it is or what they do that maintains that level of growth for them.

852
01:20:36,960 --> 01:20:42,240
Some people have a formula. So like, if you look at someone like Joe Bartolosi, right. And he,

853
01:20:42,240 --> 01:20:46,560
he always does the reacts like that. That is his thing. Like when you see this, like, you know,

854
01:20:46,560 --> 01:20:50,000
green screen video behind him with him with his signature beating, like

855
01:20:50,880 --> 01:20:55,680
his community is huge. His engagement rate is really, really high. It's like insanely high. And

856
01:20:56,880 --> 01:21:00,080
I think he's also still in college as well. Like I'm surprised he hasn't just kind of

857
01:21:00,560 --> 01:21:04,160
done content creation full time at this point. Cause like clearly he could. Um, but like,

858
01:21:05,040 --> 01:21:10,480
I think that some people have that formula kind of in it, not just the formula, but like a really,

859
01:21:10,480 --> 01:21:16,080
really solid community. Cause like there's entire TikTok trends centered around him, like him being in

860
01:21:16,080 --> 01:21:22,240
the hills or like people doing parodies of like people make content for him at a certain point,

861
01:21:22,240 --> 01:21:26,640
right? Like they're doing fan drawings. They're doing like skits. They're, they're, they're mimicking.

862
01:21:26,640 --> 01:21:31,920
Um, and I think that virality, if you're able to turn it into a community so that he also has like

863
01:21:31,920 --> 01:21:36,800
the Twitch stream and YouTube and like all these other platforms where he's also really big on the

864
01:21:36,800 --> 01:21:42,800
other ones. Um, and maybe I can get him on this podcast and talk about it later. But essentially,

865
01:21:42,800 --> 01:21:48,720
it's like, I think that a lot of people have these viral moments. Like, I don't know if you remember

866
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:53,920
the, like one guy who did the dancing in front of the mirror and literally everyone did that trend of

867
01:21:53,920 --> 01:22:01,200
like, I think I know what you're talking about. Like Jamie Bish guy. He, he was like the official,

868
01:22:01,200 --> 01:22:06,320
yeah, official TikTok accounts like commented on his stuff. Every single creator, big creator was doing

869
01:22:06,320 --> 01:22:12,480
the like transition of the mirror thing. Um, I think most cases are more similar to that.

870
01:22:12,480 --> 01:22:18,560
And I feel like there are like almost seasons of virality. So like my season essentially ended

871
01:22:18,560 --> 01:22:23,280
after like three months. And then since then it's been like very flat, but like some people like,

872
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:28,480
you know, they're always in season. Um, and so their videos always blow up. And so like,

873
01:22:28,480 --> 01:22:32,480
I think Joe has been doing this for longer than you, even he's been doing for like three or four

874
01:22:32,480 --> 01:22:39,840
years at this point, like three videos every single day, um, with that exact format. And like, I,

875
01:22:40,800 --> 01:22:49,920
I think that the format is really engaging because people like the exaggeration. They like the,

876
01:22:51,040 --> 01:22:55,200
like you mentioned, like you mentioned before the theatrics of it. Um, because at the end of the day,

877
01:22:55,200 --> 01:23:00,320
it's still an entertainment app. Like people come on here to be entertained in some way. And like,

878
01:23:00,320 --> 01:23:06,080
if they happen to learn something useful or, um, better themselves, that's like a cherry on top,

879
01:23:06,080 --> 01:23:11,600
but the core of it is still like, it has to be entertaining. True. I forget that sometimes,

880
01:23:11,600 --> 01:23:15,600
but like at the end of the day, it has to be entertaining for people to watch and follow.

881
01:23:16,240 --> 01:23:22,480
Yeah. Well, that's interesting, but I think, um, yeah, it's what I tend to see happen is like,

882
01:23:22,480 --> 01:23:27,120
most people will have that like season of virality. And then unless you come up with

883
01:23:27,760 --> 01:23:32,880
another thing that takes off, you're just going to plateau. And so that's kind of the problem. I

884
01:23:32,880 --> 01:23:39,920
think a lot of creators run into, um, and I think I, I should try the new account thing. I do have a

885
01:23:39,920 --> 01:23:45,600
second account that has like almost 800 K where I do like Reiki videos and that really took off in the

886
01:23:45,600 --> 01:23:49,920
beginning. And I kind of almost wish I took more advantage of it because I was like, every video

887
01:23:49,920 --> 01:23:55,840
I made got over a million views on that account. Um, so it's, I think there is some truth to the,

888
01:23:55,840 --> 01:23:59,280
like, if you make a new account and one of the first like few videos goes viral, like

889
01:24:00,080 --> 01:24:06,240
you're pretty much good to go. But yeah, I don't know. Like it's, it's, it's, it's scary too,

890
01:24:06,240 --> 01:24:13,280
when so much of your identity, you know, is attached to your social media. Um, I don't know if you deal

891
01:24:13,280 --> 01:24:18,160
with this at all, but like, I sometimes that, you know, I struggle to distinguish between who's

892
01:24:18,160 --> 01:24:23,840
Sarah and who's hot high priestess, or is it the same person? And like, how do people like view me?

893
01:24:23,840 --> 01:24:30,080
Do they view me as Sarah or hot high priestess? And that can become a problem very quickly,

894
01:24:30,080 --> 01:24:35,600
because if your social media is tied to your identity, then so much of your self-worth is

895
01:24:35,600 --> 01:24:40,880
going to be dependent on how well your videos do and things like that. Um, so that's something,

896
01:24:40,880 --> 01:24:45,840
obviously I think every creator in some sense struggles with, um, that's something I had to

897
01:24:45,840 --> 01:24:50,240
struggle with a little bit, but yeah, I don't know. Do you feel like you have

898
01:24:51,040 --> 01:24:53,760
two separate identities or are they kind of merging together?

899
01:24:54,880 --> 01:24:59,120
I think mine has always kind of just been the same. Like I've always not really had much of a

900
01:24:59,120 --> 01:25:03,840
filter. And I think that's actually one of the reasons that people like my content is that like,

901
01:25:04,720 --> 01:25:09,680
I mostly just say what I'm thinking and it might not always be like the most politically correct

902
01:25:09,680 --> 01:25:16,160
or like the popular view, but I think a lot of people do think it in a sense. So even if I say

903
01:25:16,160 --> 01:25:22,160
something that's not popular, I think I take a lot of my value as a person more towards fatherhood at

904
01:25:22,160 --> 01:25:30,560
this point. Um, so like social media is interesting and I think I'll probably continue until I don't

905
01:25:30,560 --> 01:25:35,840
know, I get bored one day, but I have struggled less with that. I think the thing I struggled with

906
01:25:35,840 --> 01:25:41,920
more is like the general sense of negativity. It's like really easy. Like in the beginning, I would,

907
01:25:41,920 --> 01:25:47,920
I didn't make any critical comment or content of like other creators or topics or whatever.

908
01:25:47,920 --> 01:25:53,280
Um, and at a certain point, I kind of realized that like my mindset was just more trending towards

909
01:25:53,280 --> 01:25:59,040
the like criticism. Cause like my, my natural inclination is to like, think about why someone

910
01:25:59,040 --> 01:26:04,160
is wrong or why this idea doesn't work or how something could be improved. I think a lot of

911
01:26:04,160 --> 01:26:08,960
engineers think this way. It's like, it's easier to poke holes in an idea than to like propose a

912
01:26:08,960 --> 01:26:14,000
solution that would work. Um, just from like the nature of, I think, a logically minded people maybe.

913
01:26:14,960 --> 01:26:18,560
But in a sense that like at a certain point I was thinking like, man,

914
01:26:19,680 --> 01:26:22,960
and also there's the whole like tape blowing up thing where it's like, oh, you can just be

915
01:26:22,960 --> 01:26:30,480
controversial. And I think it's like, there are other creators who copied that. Um, and it clearly

916
01:26:30,480 --> 01:26:36,880
works right. This funnel works that people want to really blow up and they can say continually

917
01:26:36,880 --> 01:26:40,480
controversial things. And like, I think a lot of people don't know what a sales funnel is.

918
01:26:40,480 --> 01:26:44,240
Um, but, uh, maybe I'll go over real quick, but sales funnel, basically at the top of the funnel,

919
01:26:44,240 --> 01:26:49,600
you try to get views and then you provide a value add. And basically at each step you provide more

920
01:26:49,600 --> 01:26:54,080
and more value and it gets more and more expensive. And the entire goal is to get your customer at the

921
01:26:54,080 --> 01:26:58,720
bottom of the funnel to buy the most expensive thing. Um, so like in the Tate funnel, the bottom

922
01:26:58,720 --> 01:27:05,440
is essentially private coaching by him because his class, you get taught by a bunch of like randos.

923
01:27:05,440 --> 01:27:09,680
You don't even actually work with them. But at the very bottom of like the exclusive club,

924
01:27:09,680 --> 01:27:15,600
there's like a $35,000 per month thing where you actually get to talk with him. And that's

925
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:20,640
what he's trying to push everyone towards. And it's like, because of how the algorithm works and

926
01:27:20,640 --> 01:27:27,360
because of his like, honestly, brilliantly executed affiliate marketing scheme, which other people

927
01:27:27,360 --> 01:27:32,320
have now done essentially to be like, Hey, here are all these clips, post them. I'll give you a cut of

928
01:27:32,320 --> 01:27:36,720
people who sign up. Like that's not a new thing. People have been doing this for forever on YouTube

929
01:27:36,720 --> 01:27:42,880
and et cetera, but they just haven't had the benefit of an algorithm that promotes controversial

930
01:27:42,880 --> 01:27:50,400
content or promotes a lot of this like clickbaity type stuff. Um, as effectively like news sites,

931
01:27:50,400 --> 01:27:55,360
I've already realized, okay, if we, we want to keep people on continuing to watching,

932
01:27:55,360 --> 01:28:00,400
we want to make them feel like fear or anger. And like Facebook has gotten a ton of criticism for this.

933
01:28:00,400 --> 01:28:05,120
Um, but that's, that's how you kind of appeal to humans in general, like through their emotion,

934
01:28:05,120 --> 01:28:08,960
like not through their logic, regardless of how logically minded someone might be.

935
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:15,120
Um, and so I forgot where I was going with this. What was, what was I even talking about?

936
01:28:16,960 --> 01:28:25,120
Um, the controversy on social media, maybe I forget, but to your point, um, no, I think that's

937
01:28:25,840 --> 01:28:32,800
like, so true is like controversy just tends to do well on social media. And I think maybe part of the,

938
01:28:32,800 --> 01:28:38,720
well, a lot of these TikTokers I noticed who have like 10 million followers and things like that,

939
01:28:38,720 --> 01:28:46,720
they started as controversial figures, you know, or, you know, whoever is popular right now.

940
01:28:46,720 --> 01:28:52,320
Like, yeah, exactly. So to some extent they started as controversial figures, whether or not they're

941
01:28:52,320 --> 01:28:58,480
controversial now, I don't know, but that was really what made them successful. And I think by

942
01:28:58,480 --> 01:29:05,440
nature, what I do, like tarot, especially is controversial. Um, manifestation is controversial

943
01:29:05,440 --> 01:29:11,200
subject. Um, so by nature, what I'm revolving my content around is controversial, but then if you

944
01:29:11,200 --> 01:29:16,880
can tap into even more controversy videos do really well, you know? Um, and so I think that's another

945
01:29:16,880 --> 01:29:23,280
thing that a lot of creators have to overcome is not just hate comments, but disagreement. Like

946
01:29:24,160 --> 01:29:30,320
I had to start viewing hate and disagreement as like a good thing because that fuels the algorithm,

947
01:29:30,320 --> 01:29:34,640
you know? Like, and it's hard to get that through your head. Like you're very tempted in the beginning

948
01:29:34,640 --> 01:29:39,680
to like delete the videos that get a lot of hate. Like when I first started, all my videos were flooded

949
01:29:39,680 --> 01:29:45,200
with like Christian Jesus people being like, Oh my God, she's the devil. I'm like, blah, blah,

950
01:29:45,200 --> 01:29:51,280
blah. And I'm like, and I was really tempted to delete their comments, delete the videos. Um,

951
01:29:51,280 --> 01:29:56,080
because it's hard in the beginning. Like you're not yet numb to that. I think you eventually become

952
01:29:56,080 --> 01:30:00,000
numb, but in the beginning you're not. And you're very affected by these things personally,

953
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:06,160
take it very personal. So over time you start to realize if you don't, I think this is the

954
01:30:06,160 --> 01:30:11,440
difference between successful creators and not successful creators. You have to unfortunately

955
01:30:11,440 --> 01:30:16,720
distance yourself from your content and from the results of your content and the audience that

956
01:30:16,720 --> 01:30:22,560
it's reaching to a very, you know, small degree, because if you don't and you take everything so

957
01:30:22,560 --> 01:30:28,800
personally, like you'll never succeed. Um, and so I think one of this, the things that like I realized

958
01:30:28,800 --> 01:30:36,640
was if I could begin to view controversy arguments in the comments, things like that as like energy

959
01:30:36,640 --> 01:30:42,560
that would like almost lift me up, then like I could succeed. And that's what I did. And I think

960
01:30:42,560 --> 01:30:47,040
now things aren't so controversial because obviously my audience is people who like love and understand

961
01:30:47,040 --> 01:30:52,080
manifestation and tarot. But in the beginning, I think that's what like caused the uptick.

962
01:30:52,880 --> 01:30:57,600
Yeah, that's really an interesting theory. Um, I saw a YouTube video that was kind of analyzing

963
01:30:58,400 --> 01:31:04,000
controversial creators and basically when creators get caught up in a controversy, that's the most

964
01:31:04,000 --> 01:31:08,320
popular that they've ever been, or it creates a huge spike in their popularity. Um, because the

965
01:31:08,320 --> 01:31:12,720
controversy, like you said, it gets more views and that engagement, whether positive or negative,

966
01:31:12,720 --> 01:31:19,360
negative fuels the algorithm reaching you to new heights, a new audience. And it just makes you

967
01:31:19,360 --> 01:31:24,800
like afterwards controversy usually fades. I think the only people who truly, you know,

968
01:31:24,800 --> 01:31:29,280
get canceled are the ones who, like you said, can't take it anymore. Like they succumb to all the hate

969
01:31:29,280 --> 01:31:34,640
comments and then they stop creating content. I think a really famous example is, uh, Jenna Marbles.

970
01:31:34,640 --> 01:31:40,880
I don't know. Yeah, but like she was very unproblematic, unproblematic, right? She made really

971
01:31:41,680 --> 01:31:46,320
wholesome content for the most part, but then like culturally she had some missteps which were

972
01:31:46,320 --> 01:31:51,120
acceptable at the time, but then later on extremely not acceptable. Uh, and then she's just like,

973
01:31:51,120 --> 01:31:55,200
yeah, I'm going to stop. And like, realistically, she could have kept going and everyone would still

974
01:31:55,200 --> 01:32:00,000
watch her stuff. Um, but like, you know, she was like, okay, you know what? I, I can't, I can't

975
01:32:00,000 --> 01:32:04,240
deal with this. I can't handle it. I'm stepping out. And I think she like, you know, that was her

976
01:32:04,240 --> 01:32:07,920
persona on the internet. There was, that wasn't a character. That was Jenna Marbles. That's who she is.

977
01:32:07,920 --> 01:32:12,560
She just, you know, put herself out there and people were kind of taking a dump on her. Um,

978
01:32:12,560 --> 01:32:19,920
um, but, um, I, I also remember the train of thought of like how we even came down this whole

979
01:32:19,920 --> 01:32:24,960
like controversy thing. Um, I think there are a couple of different ways that people deal with it.

980
01:32:25,760 --> 01:32:32,880
And I, I think that yours is, is one common one that I've seen other kind of bigger creators talk

981
01:32:32,880 --> 01:32:37,760
about as well. Like the, you'll lean something, the Asian girl who does some stereotypes, the

982
01:32:37,760 --> 01:32:40,800
comedy type stuff. And then she got a ton of pay for that. And she's like, oh yeah,

983
01:32:40,800 --> 01:32:46,240
I started distancing myself and that's what worked. Um, and then Gary V who had a pretty insightful

984
01:32:46,240 --> 01:32:49,840
method. He was saying like, oh, you know, a lot of these hate comments come from a place

985
01:32:49,840 --> 01:32:54,400
of like that person is hurting and he tries to like respond to it with positivity, which I honestly

986
01:32:54,400 --> 01:32:59,840
don't know how he does. Cause like, I think it takes a lot to respond to like hate with love,

987
01:32:59,840 --> 01:33:05,920
right? The whole MLK approach. Um, and then my approach hasn't really been either of those.

988
01:33:05,920 --> 01:33:11,760
It's been more of like, I've never cared too much about other opinions in general ever. So it's,

989
01:33:11,760 --> 01:33:17,920
when I see people's hate comments, it doesn't really affect me that much either way. Um, but I say that

990
01:33:17,920 --> 01:33:24,720
though, I think it still does affect me in a sense where like I'll respond in a multifaceted way.

991
01:33:24,720 --> 01:33:30,080
Cause like, we both know that if you respond like kind of hating on a comment or like hating on a

992
01:33:30,080 --> 01:33:37,360
video or hating on something like that does tend to do better. And yeah, I also have to like pull

993
01:33:37,360 --> 01:33:40,400
back, try to pull back from that. Cause I, at a certain point I was thinking like, oh man,

994
01:33:40,400 --> 01:33:45,200
I could just make my entire account about like debunking or like hating. Cause like,

995
01:33:45,200 --> 01:33:49,760
like there's so many big accounts that are like that are essentially just purely stitches or like

996
01:33:49,760 --> 01:33:55,040
duets of just being like, this person sucks because of X, Y, Z. And regardless of their

997
01:33:55,040 --> 01:33:59,280
packaging or messaging, like some is more harsh than others, but they're all effectively the same

998
01:33:59,280 --> 01:34:05,920
thing. It's all like online drama, essentially. It's like a battle of internet wits. I don't really

999
01:34:05,920 --> 01:34:10,960
know. Um, and I, for a second, I was almost thinking like, should I just do this? But then,

1000
01:34:10,960 --> 01:34:15,040
um, kind of similar to you, I was thinking like, is this really beneficial in a sense?

1001
01:34:15,040 --> 01:34:18,720
Like regardless of how you package it, if you look into those comment sections, regardless of how

1002
01:34:19,280 --> 01:34:25,280
nice or articulate the creator is being, it's so toxic. It's just like everyone out there is just

1003
01:34:25,280 --> 01:34:30,320
piling on whoever they stitch for duet. And it's like, I don't believe it's truly about positivity

1004
01:34:30,320 --> 01:34:34,640
because if it was like, if you see the type of people watching this content, they see the type of

1005
01:34:34,640 --> 01:34:38,880
comments they're making, like, you know what's going to happen to whoever made that original video.

1006
01:34:38,880 --> 01:34:42,720
Like they're going to private their account. They're going to like take down the video. It's,

1007
01:34:42,720 --> 01:34:49,200
it's like, I don't know. I, yeah, it's, it's hard to say like, if that's a net positive or not.

1008
01:34:49,200 --> 01:34:56,000
Um, it's, you know, more complex issue than we can probably talk about in the next 15 minutes,

1009
01:34:56,000 --> 01:35:04,320
but I do think that overall it's probably a net negative. Like it's entertainment, but the

1010
01:35:06,000 --> 01:35:10,880
not an educate, just like entertainment in the sense of like, people love to see the downfall

1011
01:35:10,880 --> 01:35:13,760
almost of someone else or love to see like the tear down.

1012
01:35:15,440 --> 01:35:21,120
Yeah. And I mean, just like on a spiritual level, I feel like, and I noticed this a lot,

1013
01:35:21,120 --> 01:35:28,080
like in people who their entire success is based around drama or tearing someone down. Like initially,

1014
01:35:28,080 --> 01:35:32,960
they're going to get abused for that. That's for sure. But I like, I feel like that's like bad

1015
01:35:32,960 --> 01:35:37,600
karma. Like it just isn't going to end well. And then I always see it. I like watch, you know,

1016
01:35:37,600 --> 01:35:41,760
a video on my FYP and it'll be like someone bashing someone else in the spiritual community. And I'm like,

1017
01:35:42,960 --> 01:35:48,240
like, even if they have a valid point, I'm like, you're one, only giving more attention to that

1018
01:35:48,240 --> 01:35:55,840
person to like, it's just, it's bad. It's bad karma. And I noticed that a lot of the times,

1019
01:35:55,840 --> 01:36:00,400
like they'll have that one video do really well. And then all their other videos tank.

1020
01:36:01,520 --> 01:36:07,520
And so, I mean, I personally like to stay out of like drama and things like that with other creators,

1021
01:36:07,520 --> 01:36:13,520
but I think having controversy and just like ideas and thoughts is like valid, you know, like to make

1022
01:36:13,520 --> 01:36:17,360
people think a different way or offer a new perspective. Like, I think that's how Andrew

1023
01:36:17,360 --> 01:36:25,040
Tate obviously became popular, like we were saying. But at the end of the day, like you were saying

1024
01:36:25,040 --> 01:36:31,680
earlier, it all stems on emotion. So if you're able to get that passion out of someone to like argue

1025
01:36:31,680 --> 01:36:38,080
and be like, you're wrong, you're right, whatever, that's what makes a video really successful. When

1026
01:36:38,080 --> 01:36:43,120
people are like arguing in the comments, it's kind of like, I almost feel like sports, you know,

1027
01:36:43,120 --> 01:36:49,760
when people really want to like defend their team, it's the same concept. But yeah, controversy on

1028
01:36:49,760 --> 01:36:55,440
social media, it's, it's a whole thing. And like, like you were saying, like responding to comments,

1029
01:36:55,440 --> 01:37:00,480
like, you know, what's going to happen to that person's account. And I think sometimes people don't

1030
01:37:00,480 --> 01:37:08,480
realize the impact. Like, I mean, I think we're pretty numb to an extent to hate and to all of these

1031
01:37:08,480 --> 01:37:15,120
things. But it still affects us sometimes, like, it can really eff you up. And I think if you're not

1032
01:37:15,120 --> 01:37:21,760
mentally there fully, it can, you know, have some really bad consequences. If someone's like making a

1033
01:37:21,760 --> 01:37:26,640
hate video about you or trying to cancel you or whatever it is, it can completely fuck a person's

1034
01:37:26,640 --> 01:37:32,720
life up like forever. And I think that's just a very scary territory to enter. Because I think we've

1035
01:37:32,720 --> 01:37:39,680
both had people, you know, make hate videos or say we were bullshit or whatever. And that's one video

1036
01:37:39,680 --> 01:37:47,120
to someone, but that could like completely destroy someone's week. You know, yeah, it's not, it's not easy.

1037
01:37:47,120 --> 01:37:56,000
Yeah. And I think that like, on that same vein, a lot of people are doing this for their livelihood,

1038
01:37:56,000 --> 01:37:59,760
like it's attached to their business, it's attached to their income, like it is their career.

1039
01:38:00,560 --> 01:38:05,120
So not only does it like the mental health aspect, but it's also tied to the financial aspect,

1040
01:38:05,120 --> 01:38:12,480
like their whole life, their identity. Yeah, it's like everything. Like, and that's why I'm trying to

1041
01:38:12,480 --> 01:38:19,840
kind of separate the hot high priestess from Sarah thing, because I don't want that to be everything

1042
01:38:19,840 --> 01:38:26,640
for me. You know, I'm very proud of my work. I love what I do. And it is who I am. But it's scary

1043
01:38:26,640 --> 01:38:35,040
when everything, you know, your whole identity, who you are is attached to the, the thoughts, emotions,

1044
01:38:35,040 --> 01:38:41,440
the comments of other people. Because that's the nature of social media, like your entire identity

1045
01:38:41,440 --> 01:38:46,880
thrives on other people's validation. So that's a very scary territory to be in.

1046
01:38:47,520 --> 01:38:51,280
I think a lot of people just don't get it. You don't get it until you're a creator yourself.

1047
01:38:52,560 --> 01:38:56,640
Yeah, I definitely don't think we were meant, like biologically, we don't have the hardware

1048
01:38:57,200 --> 01:39:02,720
really to adapt to the situation. Like humans were not meant to interact with millions of people at the

1049
01:39:02,720 --> 01:39:10,400
same time. And like, what's really hilarious is that I think the whole mental health aspect is more

1050
01:39:10,400 --> 01:39:14,560
applicable to basically every creator than you would think. So like I made a random video

1051
01:39:14,560 --> 01:39:18,880
saying Andrew Tate was broke. And his brother messaged me on Instagram.

1052
01:39:18,880 --> 01:39:20,880
I saw your video about that.

1053
01:39:20,880 --> 01:39:21,520
And I was thinking...

1054
01:39:21,520 --> 01:39:22,880
Did you respond?

1055
01:39:22,880 --> 01:39:26,320
No, I didn't respond because I don't respond to Instagram DMs. But I was,

1056
01:39:26,320 --> 01:39:28,080
my mind was blown because I was thinking like,

1057
01:39:28,880 --> 01:39:35,040
this dude that has the emotional maturity of like, a child, but he's one of the most famous

1058
01:39:35,040 --> 01:39:39,840
people on the planet. And I was just thinking like, this is the person, this person who clearly has

1059
01:39:39,840 --> 01:39:46,000
like mental issues or like, is not emotionally intelligent. And so many people look up to them,

1060
01:39:46,000 --> 01:39:55,120
right? And it's, I've also like, had conversations with other creators that are just not quite all

1061
01:39:55,120 --> 01:40:00,720
there in the head. In terms of like, extreme narcissistic personality, or

1062
01:40:03,360 --> 01:40:08,640
almost close to psychopathy. Like they clearly shouldn't even be online. Like they're at the

1063
01:40:08,640 --> 01:40:13,600
point where like their mental health is so in the gutter or near it that it's like, why are you even

1064
01:40:13,600 --> 01:40:18,160
making this content? Like, why are you doing this to yourself? And I guess like they might, like you said,

1065
01:40:18,160 --> 01:40:23,120
they might be addicted to the dopamine and chasing the, the dragon or whatever. But it's just like,

1066
01:40:23,680 --> 01:40:28,320
I don't know, it's crazy. It's probably not healthy. Like I, I could see,

1067
01:40:30,480 --> 01:40:35,440
you see a glimpse of how celebrities turn out the way that they are. Because that's like,

1068
01:40:36,240 --> 01:40:41,600
what we're doing dialed up to 100. If we're at like a 10, they're at like a 99, 98.

1069
01:40:42,160 --> 01:40:47,040
Um, and it's like, I think that's just a whole nother level. Because then there's like details

1070
01:40:47,040 --> 01:40:53,360
coming to light about like, not just all the like, weird sexual stuff that goes on in Hollywood,

1071
01:40:53,360 --> 01:40:58,400
but also all of like the control, and how they like manage your family, and they threaten your

1072
01:40:58,400 --> 01:41:02,800
family. And it's like, we see actors, and we think that they're the ones who have the wealth and the

1073
01:41:02,800 --> 01:41:07,920
power and the control. But no, like, if you see how the actors interact with producers and directors,

1074
01:41:07,920 --> 01:41:11,120
and then how those people interact with like the showrunners, and how the showrunners,

1075
01:41:11,120 --> 01:41:16,560
like there's like this entire hierarchy that's kind of like more shadowy that people don't understand

1076
01:41:16,560 --> 01:41:21,200
unless you're in the industry, and which I certainly didn't know about until I worked at Netflix.

1077
01:41:22,400 --> 01:41:29,760
Yeah, it's insane. It, the whole thing, I don't think humans were ever designed for this. And

1078
01:41:29,760 --> 01:41:36,160
especially when it comes to like the dopamine conversation. I think it's so toxic. I think it's

1079
01:41:36,160 --> 01:41:43,040
so it's it becomes an addiction. Not for everyone, I think, but a lot of people I feel are susceptible to

1080
01:41:43,040 --> 01:41:48,400
it, especially people who grew up on social media, and know the feeling that when you have your own

1081
01:41:48,400 --> 01:41:52,880
personal Instagram account, you know, when it gets 100 likes on Instagram, you know, a post like the

1082
01:41:52,880 --> 01:42:00,960
validation you feel from that now times 100 times 1000, it can enter really toxic territory. And I

1083
01:42:00,960 --> 01:42:05,440
think like, like I was saying earlier, especially if you're not fully there, like you have ADHD,

1084
01:42:05,440 --> 01:42:11,840
it can destroy you, it really can. So you have to be careful. Also, Andrew Tate's brother.

1085
01:42:14,480 --> 01:42:20,880
So that's such an L for him. I'm sorry. I like I read that. And I cannot believe,

1086
01:42:20,880 --> 01:42:24,480
like the message I was reading, because I was thinking, like, did that intern write this or

1087
01:42:24,480 --> 01:42:28,400
something? Like, it has a blue checkmark, like, let me check this account. And it's like, oh, yeah,

1088
01:42:28,400 --> 01:42:33,120
2 million followers. I'm like, dude, like, what do you think I'm gonna do with this message?

1089
01:42:33,120 --> 01:42:37,840
Like, you think I'm just gonna, I'm gonna feel bad? Like, or? Yeah, I don't know. I

1090
01:42:37,840 --> 01:42:44,000
like, it's, I mean, but I think it like brings to light like a broader message, which is that people

1091
01:42:44,000 --> 01:42:50,720
with like, 1% of the talent that you have, or the capacity that you have are running the world or

1092
01:42:50,720 --> 01:42:55,440
running social media or running much more successful businesses than you. So you know,

1093
01:42:55,440 --> 01:43:00,480
for anyone watching the podcast, like, if Andrew Tate's brother could be successful,

1094
01:43:00,480 --> 01:43:06,000
what's stopping you? Like, there's literally nothing. Exactly. That's a great message to end on.

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There's a very popular Steve Jobs clip where he says essentially the same thing, like the entire

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world, all the rules, society as you know it, was made by people no smarter than you are. So really,

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you have the power to go out and change it. Exactly. Period. So thank you, Sarah, for joining us.

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And thank you to everyone listening to the Frankly Speaking podcast. Sarah, would you like to end with

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anything? Well, thank you for having me. My socials are all @hothighpriestess, TikTok, Instagram,

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YouTube. You can find me on there. I also have a workshop, which you could grab. The link is in

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any of my bios. And that's it. Thank you so much.