1 00:00:00,460 --> 00:00:04,560 Hi, I'm Frank, and you're listening to the first episode of Frankly Speaking. 2 00:00:05,540 --> 00:00:09,640 I'm going to share my personal journey on how I was able to retire at 30 years old. 3 00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:13,620 I hope you'll enjoy my story and learn something along the way. 4 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:16,240 Let's start at the beginning. 5 00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:21,720 I was born in China and then eventually immigrated over to the United States when I was four years old. 6 00:00:22,460 --> 00:00:24,500 My dad's family grew up extremely poor. 7 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:27,520 My grandfather didn't even know how to read. 8 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:28,980 He was a literal peasant. 9 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:34,400 My dad was able to bring his family out of poverty by studying extremely hard. 10 00:00:35,300 --> 00:00:40,040 He studied so much that he was able to recite books cover to cover, word for word. 11 00:00:40,740 --> 00:00:42,480 All that studying eventually paid off. 12 00:00:43,160 --> 00:00:46,800 He obtained a full scholarship to a PhD program in the United States. 13 00:00:47,580 --> 00:00:49,980 I stayed in China until I was four years old, though. 14 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:54,700 My parents didn't have the financial means to bring their kid along with them. 15 00:00:55,720 --> 00:00:57,760 So how did I get the name Frank? 16 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:05,120 When I first came over to the States, I could not speak any English, so I wasn't really able to play with other little kids. 17 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:09,280 All I did every day was watch a ton of TV. 18 00:01:10,100 --> 00:01:12,540 My favorite show was called Franklin the Turtle. 19 00:01:13,820 --> 00:01:16,520 When my parents asked me, what do you want your English name to be? 20 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:19,900 I responded with Frank, because I wanted to be like that turtle. 21 00:01:21,060 --> 00:01:23,560 I was your pretty typical high-achieving Asian kid. 22 00:01:24,140 --> 00:01:29,540 My parents would reward me with $5 for every A, but would actually take away money for every B. 23 00:01:30,500 --> 00:01:35,480 This worked out in my favor, because I only got one B all the way up until junior year of high school. 24 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:39,400 I didn't have a whole lot of guidance from my parents growing up. 25 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:41,660 They were mostly busy just trying to keep us alive. 26 00:01:42,380 --> 00:01:46,480 Eventually, I got a bunch of offers from various schools, and I had a tough decision to make. 27 00:01:47,440 --> 00:01:53,600 Do I go to a local state school which offered me a full scholarship, or do I take out loans and go to a more prestigious school? 28 00:01:54,740 --> 00:01:57,520 I eventually settled on going to my local state school. 29 00:01:58,080 --> 00:02:03,660 I didn't want to be burdened with loans, and I also didn't want to add any additional financial pressure on my parents. 30 00:02:04,460 --> 00:02:09,300 Like many kids, I really had no idea what I wanted to do or what I wanted to study. 31 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:13,980 As a 17-year-old kid, the main thing I was worried about was playing video games. 32 00:02:14,660 --> 00:02:18,980 I loved playing games so much that I now have permanent nerve damage in my right hand. 33 00:02:20,180 --> 00:02:24,060 The school that offered me a full scholarship was known to have a decent engineering program. 34 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:30,740 I saw that the school also had computer engineering, and I selected that as my major because I was so into computer games. 35 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:33,380 I basically lucked into tech. 36 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:36,800 Back then, it wasn't nearly as popular as it is today. 37 00:02:37,860 --> 00:02:41,760 I actually held a lot of regret by not choosing to go to the more prestigious school. 38 00:02:42,700 --> 00:02:45,580 It didn't matter in the long term, but I always thought, what if? 39 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:49,020 Was my school pedigree holding me back from certain job opportunities? 40 00:02:49,780 --> 00:02:53,160 In all likelihood, it probably was, but not enough to matter. 41 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:56,920 I tried really hard my first year of college. 42 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:03,260 I was able to get a 4.0 GPA and also a couple leadership positions at various places in the school. 43 00:03:04,020 --> 00:03:05,520 Here's some advice from college. 44 00:03:06,060 --> 00:03:07,140 Don't get fat. 45 00:03:07,920 --> 00:03:11,100 I was an athlete in high school, which meant that I ate a lot. 46 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:16,520 Once I got to college, I continued to eat the same amount, but basically stopped exercising. 47 00:03:17,820 --> 00:03:23,100 I ballooned up from 200 pounds all the way up to 270 pounds. 48 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:26,380 It was really painful trying to lose all this weight. 49 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:30,540 I got an internship at IBM during my sophomore year. 50 00:03:30,660 --> 00:03:33,640 I learned a lot during my time there and had a lot of fun. 51 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:39,580 I was able to finish my project within a month, and they didn't really have any more work for me to do. 52 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:49,080 So my daily schedule during my internship would be go to work, hit a button, and wait for all the automation to run, and then go play discus with my friends for the rest of the day. 53 00:03:50,920 --> 00:03:54,860 After I went back to university, I started playing a game called League of Legends. 54 00:03:55,660 --> 00:03:57,360 This was a terrible decision. 55 00:03:58,120 --> 00:03:59,620 I was addicted to that game. 56 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:02,740 I would play 8 to 10 hours every single day minimum. 57 00:04:03,540 --> 00:04:05,500 My grades suffered drastically. 58 00:04:06,460 --> 00:04:12,300 I was eventually forced to drop a couple of classes just because I was failing them, and they were required to graduate. 59 00:04:13,540 --> 00:04:18,000 It got to the point where I was almost about to get kicked out of my dorm, and I was the president. 60 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:23,760 Luckily for me, I did drop those classes before the deadline, and I was able to retake them later. 61 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:27,900 My course load was the pretty typical computer engineering track. 62 00:04:28,700 --> 00:04:33,600 I ended up taking psychology and economics for my electives just because I heard they were pretty easy. 63 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:40,560 In psychology, I ended up getting an A- because the teacher took attendance, and that counted towards your grade. 64 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:46,380 I remember emailing my teacher at the end of the semester asking if she could bump up my grade. 65 00:04:46,980 --> 00:04:49,500 She did not end up raising my grade to an A. 66 00:04:51,500 --> 00:04:54,140 Junior year, I returned to IBM for a different internship. 67 00:04:55,100 --> 00:05:00,460 At this point, I recognized that my GPA is probably good enough to get a job, so I start slacking off. 68 00:05:01,220 --> 00:05:08,520 I try to maintain above a 3.0 GPA, but otherwise spend most of my time watching anime and playing video games. 69 00:05:10,260 --> 00:05:13,280 Back then, League of Legends still had the ELO rating system. 70 00:05:14,180 --> 00:05:15,280 I was around 1,700. 71 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:20,420 There was another intern at IBM who was semi-pro, and he was around 2,100. 72 00:05:22,380 --> 00:05:26,320 I graduated college in 2013, and IBM gave me a return offer. 73 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:31,580 For all my interviews as a software engineer, they took place in the College of Engineering. 74 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:34,640 The atmosphere in the waiting rooms was heavy. 75 00:05:35,620 --> 00:05:41,760 Everyone was busy frantically studying their notes, trying to cram as much knowledge as possible before the interviews took place. 76 00:05:42,900 --> 00:05:48,400 I also happened to interview for a couple of consulting and sales roles, and this took place in the College of Business. 77 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:52,460 It was crazy how different the atmosphere was. 78 00:05:53,380 --> 00:05:57,820 People were laughing with each other, everyone was joking around, no one was studying. 79 00:05:58,700 --> 00:06:01,820 There was actually a person who was going around and having drinks with people. 80 00:06:03,420 --> 00:06:11,680 I received offers for tech sales positions, consultancies, and other software companies, but the IBM one sounded the most interesting. 81 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:14,500 I was going to be a cloud engineer. 82 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:22,740 IBM's final offer to me was $74,000 per year in base salary, and I negotiated a signing bonus of $4,000. 83 00:06:24,020 --> 00:06:27,020 They also paid for my entire relocation out to Boston. 84 00:06:28,260 --> 00:06:29,580 The job wasn't that hard. 85 00:06:30,300 --> 00:06:36,160 A typical day for me would be to go into work around 9 a.m., work for a couple hours, take a long lunch, and then leave early. 86 00:06:37,140 --> 00:06:38,640 So I just moved to a new city. 87 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:41,640 No friends, no family, nothing to do. 88 00:06:42,280 --> 00:06:44,040 All I do every day is go to the gym. 89 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:49,560 Luckily, we had an on-site gym at work, and so I would just work out for two hours every single day. 90 00:06:50,700 --> 00:06:52,620 I also started eating a lot more healthy. 91 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:55,580 I would eat a banana and a couple of cashews for breakfast. 92 00:06:56,100 --> 00:06:58,760 Whatever random food they had in the cafeteria for lunch. 93 00:06:59,420 --> 00:07:00,860 And then chicken and broccoli for dinner. 94 00:07:01,840 --> 00:07:09,780 I also got my wisdom teeth taken out during this time, and that helped me lose 10 pounds in one week just because I was in so much pain and I couldn't really eat anything. 95 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:15,060 IBM was a great place to start my career, but it got boring pretty quickly. 96 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:16,860 I'm doing well at work. 97 00:07:16,860 --> 00:07:18,980 My manager is giving me really good feedback. 98 00:07:19,740 --> 00:07:23,580 I was saving a ton of money during this time, and I'm generally very comfortable. 99 00:07:24,460 --> 00:07:30,040 It wasn't until my girlfriend got a job offer at Facebook in San Francisco that I started wondering if I should leave. 100 00:07:30,780 --> 00:07:36,700 On one hand, I had been getting good feedback at work from my manager, and I was expecting a promotion and a large raise. 101 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:43,380 But on the other hand, my girlfriend is now moving out to SF, and SF is like the tech mecca of the world. 102 00:07:43,960 --> 00:07:47,780 It's full of amazing job opportunities, and I had always wanted to work there. 103 00:07:48,740 --> 00:07:53,500 I talked to my parents about potentially quitting my job, and obviously they are against it. 104 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:59,960 They recommended that I take the safe path, keep my head down at work, and continue to earn money at IBM. 105 00:08:01,540 --> 00:08:03,120 Fast forward to performance reviews. 106 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:06,160 I'm pretty excited because I'm expecting a raise and a promotion. 107 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:09,420 I don't end up getting a promotion. 108 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:11,920 My raise is 1.1%. 109 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:16,240 Of course, I get the promotion and raise dangled over my head. 110 00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:20,040 They say, hey, wait another couple months, wait another half year, we can talk again. 111 00:08:20,900 --> 00:08:23,320 I'm extremely frustrated at this point. 112 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:25,780 In my mind, I was already ready to leave. 113 00:08:26,540 --> 00:08:30,100 What's funny is that once I actually got other job offers and told them I was leaving, 114 00:08:30,460 --> 00:08:33,620 they very readily offered me a substantial raise to stay. 115 00:08:34,060 --> 00:08:39,300 At that point, I kind of learned that my value to their company was worth a lot more than what they were paying me. 116 00:08:39,300 --> 00:08:44,980 And it also made me recognize how much you contribute at work is not correlated to the amount of money that you're making. 117 00:08:45,460 --> 00:08:50,520 Some of the more senior members of my team contributed a lot less, but were making a lot more money than me. 118 00:08:51,580 --> 00:08:56,540 Before I actually started my job search in earnest, I also dabbled in day trading. 119 00:08:57,500 --> 00:09:01,780 Wolf of Wall Street had just come out, and I thought, how hard could it be to trade full-time? 120 00:09:02,180 --> 00:09:02,980 It seems so easy. 121 00:09:03,780 --> 00:09:05,720 You can pretty much imagine what happened next. 122 00:09:06,380 --> 00:09:08,620 I had some initial success with penny stocks. 123 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:11,100 I was able to double $2,000 to $4,000. 124 00:09:11,980 --> 00:09:13,120 And then I got greedy. 125 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:15,600 I started putting more money in. 126 00:09:16,100 --> 00:09:18,180 $15,000, then $30,000. 127 00:09:18,980 --> 00:09:20,420 You can kind of guess how this ends. 128 00:09:21,340 --> 00:09:24,500 I lost the majority of that money and got margin called by Fidelity. 129 00:09:25,940 --> 00:09:31,100 Fidelity actually did a study on who their most profitable traders are, and you'll be surprised at their results. 130 00:09:32,140 --> 00:09:34,660 It's basically people who forget about their account. 131 00:09:35,700 --> 00:09:37,660 99% of day traders lose money. 132 00:09:38,420 --> 00:09:42,140 Maybe you'll be in that top 1%, but most likely you're not. 133 00:09:42,680 --> 00:09:47,280 Humans are extremely emotional, and we tend to buy and sell at the worst possible moments. 134 00:09:47,860 --> 00:09:49,400 Which I had to learn the hard way. 135 00:09:51,260 --> 00:09:57,440 Because IBM was so large and process-laden, I wanted to go the exact opposite route and go to the tiniest startup I could find. 136 00:09:58,820 --> 00:10:00,740 Douala gave me an exploding offer. 137 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:04,200 So that basically means they only gave me a couple days to accept. 138 00:10:05,220 --> 00:10:09,240 Back then, I didn't really realize that this was just a poor negotiation tactic. 139 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:13,520 I thought that they would actually rescind my offer if I wanted an extension. 140 00:10:14,420 --> 00:10:18,820 They offered me a $130,000 base salary, and also some stock options. 141 00:10:19,680 --> 00:10:22,380 Eventually, those stock options would become worthless, but oh well. 142 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:27,040 My girlfriend and I actually break up before I even moved to San Francisco. 143 00:10:27,740 --> 00:10:30,360 And I also had a lot of trouble just trying to find housing. 144 00:10:30,900 --> 00:10:34,560 Initially, I was going to move in with this guy who was renting out his extra room. 145 00:10:35,200 --> 00:10:38,960 His parents helped him pay for a two-bedroom condo, and he was looking to make a little extra cash. 146 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:41,920 Two weeks before I move out there, 147 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:45,720 he tells me that he found someone else who was willing to pay a higher price for rent. 148 00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:50,660 So at this point, I'm scrambling because I'm about to move out there and I have nowhere to live. 149 00:10:51,560 --> 00:10:53,680 And this is how I met my crazy roommate. 150 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:54,780 Let's call her Karen. 151 00:10:55,860 --> 00:10:57,920 Karen was a forex trader at a large bank. 152 00:10:58,680 --> 00:11:01,560 She was an attractive young woman with a lot of attitude. 153 00:11:02,740 --> 00:11:07,480 I later learned that she was a pathological liar, but that didn't happen until much later. 154 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:17,900 I found her listing on Airbnb originally, and we had a deal where I would move in for a month to see how it was and then potentially sign a longer-term lease if things worked out. 155 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:21,540 Moving to San Francisco was amazing for my career. 156 00:11:22,820 --> 00:11:24,380 Douala had really good technology. 157 00:11:25,380 --> 00:11:31,780 I was introduced to many modern programming concepts such as test-driven development, microservices, and AWS. 158 00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:36,700 Because there weren't that many engineers, I was given a lot of responsibility. 159 00:11:37,660 --> 00:11:39,820 It was the complete opposite of IBM. 160 00:11:41,040 --> 00:11:43,960 It had a modern tech stack and moved much more quickly. 161 00:11:45,100 --> 00:11:46,920 There was just one problem, though. 162 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:49,540 The company didn't make any money. 163 00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:52,700 The founder tried to raise money but was unsuccessful. 164 00:11:53,540 --> 00:11:57,940 I was only at Douala for less than six months before there were company layoffs. 165 00:11:58,900 --> 00:12:03,800 They offered a couple weeks of severance, and I was unemployed for roughly a month before my next job. 166 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:08,360 That one month where I was not working, though, was actually extremely fun. 167 00:12:09,100 --> 00:12:14,460 I was going on a lot of dates, attending a lot of meetups, and just generally having a great time in SF. 168 00:12:15,380 --> 00:12:19,960 I wasn't worried about money at all because at that point, I had saved up enough for rent. 169 00:12:21,220 --> 00:12:24,260 The job market was also extremely hot. 170 00:12:24,860 --> 00:12:27,460 I had dozens of interviews lined up within the week. 171 00:12:28,980 --> 00:12:33,360 I got several offers from various tech companies but eventually decided to go with Credit Karma. 172 00:12:34,340 --> 00:12:37,100 Credit Karma looks like it had all the things that Douala did not. 173 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:40,020 They were a bit further along, they had a lot of money. 174 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:44,860 They were also part of Glassdoor's top 25 small and medium businesses to work for. 175 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:49,100 And I knew I liked the whole startup vibe, so it seemed like the perfect choice. 176 00:12:50,680 --> 00:12:55,900 They offered me $155,000 in base salary, with $100,000 in RSUs. 177 00:12:56,980 --> 00:13:00,300 They have since been acquired by Intuit, and the stocks are worth a lot more now. 178 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:06,760 I'm given a ton more responsibility at Credit Karma, and I'm able to accomplish an amazing amount of work. 179 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:12,640 Surprisingly, maybe not surprisingly, there's still a lot of politics even at these smaller companies. 180 00:13:13,460 --> 00:13:17,240 For example, there was this fitness app that we were forced to use for our health reimbursements. 181 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:20,880 It was a really sketchy app, and it wouldn't even work half the time. 182 00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:25,800 Eventually, I found out it was because the current head of HR's husband owns the company. 183 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:29,660 So I do a little bit of research into this company to see if it's legitimate. 184 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:31,540 It turns out, not really. 185 00:13:32,060 --> 00:13:34,640 The only large customer that they have is Credit Karma. 186 00:13:35,620 --> 00:13:39,320 I saw the CEO in the lunchroom one day, and I decided to confront him about it. 187 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:44,520 I first ease him into the conversation, asking about his kids, if he likes video games. 188 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:47,520 He responds and asks how I'm liking it there so far. 189 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:50,480 And that's when I hit him with the fitness app questions. 190 00:13:51,380 --> 00:13:53,580 You could tell he was pretty nervous during this time. 191 00:13:53,660 --> 00:13:54,720 He was wringing his hands. 192 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:59,260 He said he would look into it, but it was obvious that he already knew about the issue. 193 00:14:00,580 --> 00:14:05,080 That HR person eventually got fired, but she just moved on to bigger and better things elsewhere. 194 00:14:05,680 --> 00:14:07,640 It did not affect her career at all. 195 00:14:08,820 --> 00:14:14,620 There's a thing called the Peter Principle, where you basically keep on getting promoted until you're no longer good at your job. 196 00:14:15,060 --> 00:14:17,620 And thus, everyone becomes incompetent at a company. 197 00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:20,920 I would say it's even more extreme in Silicon Valley. 198 00:14:21,500 --> 00:14:25,620 Because the job market is so hot there, people basically just fail up. 199 00:14:26,300 --> 00:14:29,220 You get fired, but then you just get a promotion somewhere else. 200 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:34,160 I had an amazing time at Credit Karma and loved working there in general. 201 00:14:34,980 --> 00:14:38,480 But then 2017 happens, and the whole crypto craze started. 202 00:14:39,420 --> 00:14:45,120 Bitcoin rose from $1,000 all the way up to $20,000 in the span of essentially one year. 203 00:14:45,820 --> 00:14:53,020 Ethereum went up from $50 to over $1,000, and Litecoin went up from $4 to over $400 at its peak. 204 00:14:54,280 --> 00:14:58,680 I'm still relatively young at this point, and I'm thinking, I can't afford to miss this. 205 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:00,640 So I quit my job at Credit Karma. 206 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:06,040 I worked on the project by myself for a couple months before I convinced my friends to join. 207 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:10,280 The basic idea for the company was that we would tokenize equity. 208 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:12,680 And I guess I was pretty convincing. 209 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:14,240 I was telling them, this is the future. 210 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:15,120 We need to get on this. 211 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:17,580 We're going to become fabulously rich and change the world. 212 00:15:19,020 --> 00:15:22,340 At this point, crypto was not nearly as mainstream as it is today. 213 00:15:22,820 --> 00:15:24,980 We couldn't get any lawyers to work with us. 214 00:15:25,640 --> 00:15:26,780 We're a bunch of engineers. 215 00:15:27,040 --> 00:15:29,900 So in our minds, we think, okay, we'll build this really cool product, 216 00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:31,820 and people will just naturally come to use it. 217 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:34,180 But obviously, that's not what happened. 218 00:15:34,940 --> 00:15:38,060 After working together for several months, we have zero traction. 219 00:15:38,820 --> 00:15:43,640 The most interesting that happened during this time was we got a call with John McAfee as a potential investor. 220 00:15:44,540 --> 00:15:45,480 He did not invest. 221 00:15:46,860 --> 00:15:51,560 Not only did our startup fail to gain traction, but I'm also no longer friends with those co-founders. 222 00:15:52,540 --> 00:15:56,760 I don't care that our startup failed, but losing those friendships was pretty tough. 223 00:15:57,980 --> 00:16:01,720 At this point, I was in a pretty serious relationship, and we were looking to buy a house. 224 00:16:02,700 --> 00:16:06,580 San Francisco real estate was out of our budget, so we looked towards Chicago. 225 00:16:07,680 --> 00:16:12,480 Eventually, I got an offer at Grubhub, and they offered me around $200,000 in total comp. 226 00:16:13,300 --> 00:16:17,580 For those that don't know, most offers give you a lump sum of RSUs when you first join, 227 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:20,480 and that typically vests over four years with a one-year cliff. 228 00:16:21,140 --> 00:16:25,580 For retention purposes, you don't actually get any of your stock package unless you stay for one year. 229 00:16:27,100 --> 00:16:34,520 Grubhub's stock went to all-time highs right when I hit my one-year vesting period, so I ended the year with around $300,000 in total comp. 230 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:37,260 Our rent was also pretty cheap. 231 00:16:37,660 --> 00:16:43,200 We had a one-bedroom apartment that was decently sized, and it only cost us about $1,900 per month. 232 00:16:44,300 --> 00:16:48,120 There is a ton of great food in Chicago, and the summers are amazing. 233 00:16:48,820 --> 00:16:52,160 With the money made from selling that stock, we were looking to buy a house finally. 234 00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:56,020 But that year was also the year of the polar vortex. 235 00:16:56,800 --> 00:17:03,260 For those that don't know what that is, it's basically a certain set of climate conditions that causes extremely cold weather. 236 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:07,580 They had warnings that you shouldn't go outside because it would damage your lungs. 237 00:17:08,860 --> 00:17:12,660 This event basically made us realize that we were not going to settle down in Chicago. 238 00:17:13,660 --> 00:17:16,420 At this point, we think maybe we want to go back to California. 239 00:17:17,120 --> 00:17:20,140 Mainly because of the weather, but also because of the job opportunities. 240 00:17:20,980 --> 00:17:23,920 Even if the next role doesn't work out, I could easily find a new one. 241 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:28,240 This time around, I basically breezed through all of my interviews. 242 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:31,880 I have a lot of experience interviewing and negotiating jobs at this point. 243 00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:38,140 I initially got some offers from Bird and Wag, but they were relatively low, in the $200,000 range. 244 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:41,040 Even lower than what I was making at Grubhub at the time. 245 00:17:42,420 --> 00:17:46,020 Then I got an offer from Etsy in New York, which was around $250,000. 246 00:17:47,100 --> 00:17:49,420 I was also in the process of interviewing with Snapchat. 247 00:17:50,340 --> 00:17:54,120 At that point in time, I had never really considered even getting a fang job. 248 00:17:54,820 --> 00:17:59,680 On LinkedIn, I saw how my friends would be getting jobs at Google and Facebook and other top companies. 249 00:18:00,180 --> 00:18:07,120 And I'm thinking, wait, they're not any better than me, so clearly all I needed to do was either try harder or study more to get these jobs. 250 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:13,140 The Netflix interviews were definitely the most intense set that I did during this time. 251 00:18:13,900 --> 00:18:15,480 There were actually two days of interviews. 252 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:17,500 The first day was more technical. 253 00:18:17,780 --> 00:18:20,980 They asked me some system design questions and other technical related things. 254 00:18:21,620 --> 00:18:24,060 And then the second day was almost entirely behavioral. 255 00:18:24,780 --> 00:18:28,840 They asked you a ton of culture questions just to make sure you know what you're getting yourself into. 256 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:32,780 Their offer came in way higher than everyone else. 257 00:18:33,420 --> 00:18:40,160 The total compensation package ended up being roughly around $500,000, which was just a crazy amount of money to me at that time. 258 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:47,300 Netflix offers most of their compensation in cash, and they let you split it however you want in terms of getting their stock options. 259 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:53,540 One of the things that drew me to the company besides the high compensation package was the work culture. 260 00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:56,160 Netflix believes in people over process. 261 00:18:56,740 --> 00:18:58,220 They want to move quickly and be agile. 262 00:18:59,080 --> 00:19:01,400 There's a common saying there called freedom and responsibility. 263 00:19:02,100 --> 00:19:07,500 You're given the freedom to make your own choices, but you're also expected to take responsibility if things go wrong. 264 00:19:08,200 --> 00:19:12,140 We've moved back to the Bay Area for Netflix, and it was honestly a great place to work. 265 00:19:13,100 --> 00:19:15,740 My wife also gets pregnant with our first child around this time. 266 00:19:16,900 --> 00:19:18,680 Netflix was pretty much my dream job. 267 00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:21,700 I had finally gotten into Fang, and I'm making a ton of money. 268 00:19:22,620 --> 00:19:23,880 We have our first child. 269 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:25,700 Life definitely got more challenging. 270 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:27,540 We were tired constantly. 271 00:19:28,360 --> 00:19:32,260 Between juggling work and raising a kid, we didn't have much time for much else. 272 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:35,160 Things in general are looking good, though. 273 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:38,780 People at work say that I've changed for the better after having my kid. 274 00:19:38,940 --> 00:19:39,980 I've become a lot more patient. 275 00:19:40,780 --> 00:19:45,080 My wife and I are saving over 80% of our income in this point and investing all of it. 276 00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:49,960 And then we start looking to buy our first home in San Jose until COVID hits. 277 00:19:51,100 --> 00:19:54,780 Cities start to go into lockdown all around the world, and the stock market crashes. 278 00:19:56,100 --> 00:20:00,620 We had plans to send our kid to daycare, but now no longer feel safe doing so. 279 00:20:01,180 --> 00:20:07,220 We tell our nanny that we think we're going to start taking care of the kid ourselves and basically transition to working from home full-time. 280 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:13,840 Our initial thought was that maybe this will only last a couple months, and by the time summer rolls around, it'll be gone. 281 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:23,440 Our lease was actually ending around this time, and so we thought we might be able to move to Canada to get some help with childcare, with the plans to move back once COVID dies down. 282 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:32,840 For the next year and a half, we saved and invested over 80% of our income into crypto, cannabis, shroom stocks, and various technology stocks. 283 00:20:34,120 --> 00:20:37,840 Near the beginning of 2021, we also welcomed our second child. 284 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:45,040 Due to COVID and the lack of childcare options, I decided to take a full year of paternity leave to support my wife and family at home. 285 00:20:46,460 --> 00:20:50,220 Netflix used to have one of the most generous paternity leave offerings in the world. 286 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:54,640 I say used to, because they actually changed this policy during COVID. 287 00:20:55,700 --> 00:20:59,280 They offered up to one year paid of paternity leave. 288 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:01,100 This meant getting your full salary. 289 00:21:02,540 --> 00:21:07,040 We were extremely fortunate to be in a position to continue to invest during this time period. 290 00:21:07,500 --> 00:21:10,260 It was probably the greatest wealth transfer of our lifetimes. 291 00:21:11,340 --> 00:21:19,140 If you take a look at a lot of these asset classes, housing, crypto, stocks, even collectible card games, everything is near all-time highs. 292 00:21:20,460 --> 00:21:26,400 I'd always had a passing interest in the FIRE movement, but spending time with my kids made me consider it more seriously. 293 00:21:27,180 --> 00:21:29,760 FIRE stands for Financial Independence, Retire Early. 294 00:21:31,060 --> 00:21:34,860 $2 million was always the loose number I had in my mind for me to retire. 295 00:21:35,940 --> 00:21:42,520 At some point during paternity leave, our net worth explodes past $2 million, excluding the value of the residents that we live in. 296 00:21:43,660 --> 00:21:48,260 According to the 4% rule, we can spend roughly $80,000 per year and retire early. 297 00:21:49,140 --> 00:21:53,180 This works because on average, your investments should go up around 5% to 6% per year. 298 00:21:53,820 --> 00:21:58,100 Because you're only withdrawing 4% per year, your money should theoretically never run out. 299 00:21:58,900 --> 00:22:01,780 You can also withdraw 3% if you want it to be extra safe. 300 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:05,800 It was an amazing experience to be on paternity leave. 301 00:22:06,340 --> 00:22:09,080 I got to experience all of my child's first moments. 302 00:22:10,220 --> 00:22:16,500 And even though it was extremely difficult and tiring to take care of them, it also brought me the most amount of joy I've ever experienced. 303 00:22:18,420 --> 00:22:21,740 My manager contacts me around 6 months into my planned leave. 304 00:22:22,420 --> 00:22:31,380 So for some context, the entire reporting chain, from the VP up to my immediate manager, basically leaves or gets fired during my time at Netflix. 305 00:22:32,140 --> 00:22:36,260 During my most recent pat leave, my director and immediate manager both leave. 306 00:22:37,020 --> 00:22:42,640 My new manager contacts me and informs me that the team is struggling and she needs me to come back ASAP. 307 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:45,380 Obviously, I do not want to return early. 308 00:22:45,980 --> 00:22:49,000 I have two young infant kids, both of whom are not yet vaccinated. 309 00:22:49,540 --> 00:22:54,280 We had a death in the family just the previous year and we are not willing to take any risks with our kids. 310 00:22:55,280 --> 00:23:00,160 I let my manager know that the only way I can come back early is if an infant vaccine is available. 311 00:23:01,380 --> 00:23:03,020 She does not take this well. 312 00:23:03,420 --> 00:23:08,480 She basically responds by threatening to fire me without severance if I do not return within the week. 313 00:23:09,100 --> 00:23:14,980 She works in conjunction with HR to try and retroactively change my paternity leave dates from one year to six months. 314 00:23:15,420 --> 00:23:20,560 The only way I even found out was because I got an automated email from the HR software that we use. 315 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:28,600 I contacted our employee services team and asked about how my leave date was changed and they confirmed it was my HR business partner who did it. 316 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:32,560 My manager attempts to do some damage control via email. 317 00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:39,920 She claims to have no knowledge of why I'm trying to take one year of paternity leave, despite ample evidence that this was the plan all along. 318 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:47,220 Emails, team meetings, my calendar auto response, Slack status, one-on-ones I had with my teammates. 319 00:23:47,740 --> 00:23:51,300 All of these things confirm my original leave date of one year. 320 00:23:52,520 --> 00:24:07,440 They were essentially trying to rewrite history and force me to come back to work instead of prioritizing my family during the worst pandemic of our lifetimes. 321 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:19,860 Lawyers get involved, I report my manager and HR business partner to employee relations, which is an entirely new function at Netflix, and spend the next month extremely stressed out about the whole situation. 322 00:24:20,940 --> 00:24:22,620 Eventually, they gave me two options. 323 00:24:23,220 --> 00:24:28,800 One was to go back to work early, or two, take four months of severance and we go our separate ways. 324 00:24:29,900 --> 00:24:31,420 I took the severance. 325 00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:38,380 If you asked me to choose between the health and safety of my family over a job, I would choose my family every single time. 326 00:24:39,180 --> 00:24:43,460 We were extremely lucky to be in a financial position that allowed us to do this. 327 00:24:44,180 --> 00:24:48,300 I've had a fairly successful technology career, but it was always just a job to me. 328 00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:51,220 I don't have any great passion for computer science. 329 00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:59,320 We had consistently saved and invested most of our money during our careers, and we were finally able to hit our fire number in 2021. 330 00:25:00,700 --> 00:25:02,800 I am now the happiest I've ever been. 331 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:08,040 I can spend time with my kids, read books, watch anime, and generally do whatever I want. 332 00:25:09,140 --> 00:25:14,800 It's incredibly liberating to choose what I want to do each day and not be forced to endure corporate life. 333 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:20,800 My wife started making TikToks in her free time and challenged me to beat her number of followers by the end of the year. 334 00:25:21,340 --> 00:25:26,320 I ended up surpassing her follower count within a couple of days, and that's actually how I got started. 335 00:25:27,120 --> 00:25:30,520 In about one month, I amassed roughly 400,000 followers. 336 00:25:31,860 --> 00:25:34,700 During my journey, I never really had a mentor-type figure. 337 00:25:35,300 --> 00:25:38,680 I learned a lot of my lessons the hard way, but hopefully you don't have to. 338 00:25:39,900 --> 00:25:46,660 In the short term, I plan on continuing to make interesting content about tech, finance, general career advice, and everything else. 339 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:51,220 So this concludes my first episode of Frankly Speaking. 340 00:25:51,860 --> 00:25:54,180 I hope you found it insightful, and I'll see you next time.